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Thread: Cooperation with AI

  1. #1

    Cooperation with AI

    Sorry if this topic was already discussed.
    Well, in the first Victoria (with revolutions) it was very annoying when the AI was making a separate peace in a war. I remember a (VIP) game as Bavaria, when I organized an anti-Prussian coalition (Prussia had won the Austria-Prussian war), consisting of me, Austria, France and Russia vs. Prussia and the Ottoman Empire. Well, The French were (very slowly) pushing in the west, Austria-Russian forces were almost in Berlin, the Turkish front was being easily won, and then.... Austria made peace with Prussia (demanding 1-2 provs). The eastern front slowly collapsed, separate peace with Russia, well, the rest is obvious.
    I remember an common problem was discussed in the HoI3 thread, although there it was mainly on the problem that you couldn't launch an cooperative attack with an allied country.

  2. #2
    Second Lieutenant HappyFred321's Avatar
    Victoria 2

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    United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
    Alliances in history fell apart from time to time. But I can think of a system that may work.

    What I think would be good would be a system based on EUIII war progress display with a few additions.

    1. HTTT style war aims.

    2. Some kind of commitment meter showing the commitment each combatant has to the war, the lower the commitment the more likley a country is to make a seperate peace. Commitment could be a value which varies according to how well the war is progressing and relations with the other alliance members.

    3. A few war mangament options for alliance leaders such as setting objectives for various members of an alliance (e.g take province A,B and C). Coupled with options to prop up alling allies such as bank loans to keep up their commitment.

    4. The ability through the EUIII style war progress display to ask for aid from allies such as loans and equipment.

    5. The ability to ask neutral countries to join a war you're already fighting and bring them into you alliance.

    6. The ability to take controll of an alliance if its' leader get hammered, or lose the leadership if your alliance is joined by a more powerful country.

    I would also like named multilateral alliances. So a player could have the option of inviting multiple countries into an alliance in one go. This would allow an attack on any member to be an attack on all of them.

  3. #3
    Jäg. Holmberg Minodrin's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIMagickaVictoria: Revolutions
    Semper FiVictoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of DarknessMount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
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    I some time ago suggested something like great conferences, in essence lots of countries would come together to a separate event (screen) to decide about these and other kinds of things.
    Also known as Jäg. Holmberg

  4. #4
    earl of whateverinster alvaro's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIHearts of Iron IIIMarch of the EaglesRome GoldVictoria 2
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    this is important. i tend to not to ally to any AI country, never. what for? i don't complain about retiring from a war when losing but they steal your conquests, they retire when winning for a white peace.
    Dicen que en Portugal aun hay muchos comunistas
    pero lo que yo queria saber es donde hay señoritas

  5. #5
    Keep in mind though AI is not doing it to piss you off - it just got its own reasons (usually internal ones) that make separate peace optimal (from its point of view, with it's limited ability to "see" overall picture).

    It's not here to serve you, it's here to serve its own interest.

    What we need is either:

    - better assesment of situation for AI (hard to make and it won't neccessary help),

    - system of notifications for human player that indicate your ally is about to give up (so you can react on that); to work right, player would need diplo actions that support AI and lower it's war exhaustion allow it to prolong the war.

    WE (war exhaustion) is usually pretty good indicator here - it would be just good to have it presented in a way from EU3, where by clicking "war" icon you see overall WE of all war participants. Mentioned earlier "commitement meter" sounds good as well.

    Economical support, improving relations, spy/cover operations (provocations that rise country determination to fight) and such - all those things should be nice addition to ensure your AI ally don't bails out of the war too early.

    That would add another layer to the game, making alliance forging (and sustaining) more meaningful, with player interacting with other countries not only before they ally with him, but also later as well.
    Last edited by Alojzy; 09-11-2009 at 17:18.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Alojzy View Post
    Keep in mind though AI is not doing it to piss you off - it just got its own reasons (usually internal ones) that make separate peace optimal (from its point of view, with it's limited ability to "see" overall picture).. ...
    One could however include some very basic consideration in the fact that countries at war would in reality not look kindly on an ally bugging out of the war by making a separate peace. This would screw relations badly as it is only one step down from backstabbing. At the same time a system should be implemented that a peace deal has to sanctioned by _all_ allies. It is imo ridiculous in EU3 or Victoria that other countries will happily help you carve out an empire for _no_ gain whatsoever. If they help you, they want part of the conquest, money or some other goal fulfilled or they'll get pissed.

    Additionally there should be harsher consequences to annexing territory beyond your claims. If the dust settles post ww1 you might get away with breaking a country apart or taking a large swathe of land but otherwise any conquest of land you have no claim on should be looked at with outmost worry by every single other power in the vincinity.

    A further combination of the above should be that other great powers participate in the peace process. I'm not sure when the time of cabinet wars ended but it was common that at the conclusion of any conflict all Great Powers would participate in the peace negotiations wether they had fought in the war or not.

    All this might reduce the amount of landgrab you can push through without really disturbing your relations with allies and other powers.

    I think something like claims should be in it. They are less than cores and probably should be changed and made latter but it would create a basis on which ai and human player could agree on alliances and peace settlements among coalitions. E.g. make secret pacts already predistributing what claims are to be defended in a potential conflict and their will be great upheaval if peace is concluded with the interests of one side ignored. And maybe more ww1 like alliances. Aka France will declare it will aid Russia if it ends up at war with germany but Italy only declares to germany that it will help in a defensive war against France only.

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