Hungary AAR #1: The Reign of Ziggy I

update to 1493

Welcome back to the next installment of our gripping saga - this chapter involves several wars, an excommunication, and a National Idea....

War #16 - vs. Turkey
In Spring 1485, I DOW Turkey - no stability hit, no allies, this is war how it should be

I smash the Turkish armies early and easily (check out these two battles, gloat gloat):

My gloating is ruined as the infernal Pole continues his rebound, gaining more land in the east

But, enough about him, back to me - I land an amphibous force at Rhodes, which has the advantage that the main Turkish fleet comes to pursue me - I lose a few ships, but it's well worth it as this allows my army to pour into Asia Minor.

I don't really want to gain land myself, so much as I want to weaken Turkey - accordingly, I settle in the Spring of 1486 for a peace in which the Turk surrenders Rhodes, and some claims to land I've taken earlier. I then turn around and sell Rhodes to the Byzants, who I want to stay focused eastwards - I can only get $100 out of them, though . By the way, this was by far the highest from any interested party - most countries just don't seem to have much money, or else maybe just nobody wants Rhodes (shrug).

Overall, the war didn't cost me much, but it didn't gain me much either - this idea of fighting Turkey to get money doesn't seem to be that worthwhile.

In Spring 1487, as per the recommendation on this forum (thanks guys!), I use my second National Idea to get a National Bank.

So there I am, redeploying and refeuling, when in Spring 1488 - Castille excommunicates me AGAIN . Agghhh! And with a new young leader, to boot! Ouch, that hurts!

Man, this being subject to the Pope really hurts. You know what the Church needs? Reform. And not just a little reform, but a whole general process of it. I'd call it, you know, a "Reformation". Yeah, "Reformation", that's the ticket!

I take a step towards this immediately, as this new excommunication has worsened my relations with the Papal states to the point that the awkwardly named "Statute in Restraint of Appeals" is now possible.


This makes my Catholic neighbors dislike me much more, but in the long term gives me fewer revolts, makes stability easier, and a little more prestige - sign me up! To my surprise, this seems to have no consequences with my neighbors, maybe I'm too strong, as nobody DOWs me.

War #17: vs. Turkey

There we are in Spring 1489, when the Ottoman Turk makes a big blunder - they DOW tiny little Albania. This is a big mistake because both Byzantium and I had guaranteed their independence - between the two of us, I want to put the Ottoman to rest once and for all! "Ottoman Empire Delenda Est"!

It's deja vu all over again, as again I quickly smash the Turkish armies, and then pour into Asia Minor - the Byzantine navy seems to have cleared the way, as the Turkish navy is nowhere to be found.

There are no surprises, as Byzantium and I chew through Turkey - check out the situation in February 1491, as we have completely occupied all of Ottoman Turkey!



I now have some interesting choices - I really don't want any land in Asia Minor, I just doubt I could hold it. And sadly, of the 3 European Turkish provinces next to me, one is the Turkish capital and can't be taken, and one was taken by the Byzantines. Oh well. So instead I try, once again, not to make myself much stronger so much as to make Turkey no longer a threat.

So, I take one little European Turkish province, give 2 to Byzantium, but then make Turkey carve out two nations - here's the new map:



I could have taken more provinces and sold them to Byzantium, but (a) my experience with Rhodes shows me I probably woulnd't get much money, (b) I think I still suffer the badboy hit for taking the provinces, even if I immediatley sell them, and (c) I am now in a position where I don't want Byzantium to get any stronger! They are now really more powerful than Turkey, and, wouldn't you know it, are allied with Poland and Austria - ouch.

This 3-way alliance becomes important just a few months later. In November 1491, little Mazovia, another one of the provinces I'd made Poland turn into an independent nation, gets DOWed by ever-aggressive Poland. The good news is, Lithuania actually comes to Mazovia's defense - they are at war with Poland (oddly enough, they are still allied with them, however! How does this work?). Mazovia asks for my help. The problem is, that both Austria and Byzantium have answered Poland's call - so if I get into this mess, it will be Lithuania and me against Poland, and Austria, and Byzantium -



I decide that discretion is the better part of valor, and sadly leave Mazovia to its fate - , it gets turned back into a Polish vassal - Poland is now nearly back to Terrible status! The thing I can't understand is that Russia has been quiet as mouse for 100 years - I don't know what's keeping them from checking Poland. Oh well.

Ever since my initial move into Italy, the Italian peninsula has stayed totally quiet, keeping me from getting any CBs and snapping up any more Italian provinces - how unsporting of them!

At long last, it appears that I have an opportunity, as in June 1493 Milan DOWs Genoa. I had warned Milan, so I have a CB against them for the next year. Milan has some allies, but I think this is about as good a chance as I will get.

Stay tuned!

here's the current map of my neck of the woods:



(whoops, in the map above, where it says "Naples", it should say Milan - sorry!)

blsteen said:

Awesome going so far, never tried Hungary but I have played Austria a few times. If you don't want the asia minor provinces where are you going? Russia?

Click to expand...

Italy/Germany, if I can. Without a land bridge to Asia Minor (note that Byzant/Ottoman still control the 2 provinces that you can walk across), and with the Ottoman fleet able to "choke me off" at any point, I figured I wouldn't be able to hold onto the Asia Minor provinces.

kibitzing welcome....

ok, forum fans, i pause now and ask your advice.

The good news is, I'm a nice strong beefy empire.

the bad news is, I'm an empire in a cage.

To the northeast, I see Poland, which is slightly weaker than I am.

To the west, I see Milan, which is slightly weaker than I am.

The problem is their cursed alliances.

Poland is allied with the Byzantine Empire, and Austria, and usually with Lithuania. This is alliance "A" in the map below.

Milan is allied with Bohemia and Bavaria - alliance "B" in the map below.



I, as a bad expanding excommunicated empire, have only one ally - Brandenburg.

I can't take on either alliance, not even close.

Furthermore, many of the little nations scattered about have their independence guaranteed by one (or both!) of these alliances.

So, other than sitting on my hands a while and waiting for fortune to change things, any advice?

Murmurandus said:

Good work so far. Do you have any casus belli left?

Click to expand...

Just against Poland, and of course the Ottoman Turk.

update to 1498

Thanks everyone for your input! I started the next session after the input from wedgeskwalker9, Murmurandus, and stnylan - blsteen and sweboy, you can see that your advice was very sound as well, as we have an extremely action-packed session to report, with an enormous war.

So there I am in June 1493, taking wedgeskwalker9's advice to heart, clicking around the map trying to find minors with no friends, when I notice that of all my neighbors, only Venezia has no allies. Normally this is not a big deal, as Venice is invulnerable due to its fleet, but I notice in my clicking-around that ---- I don't see the Venetian fleet anywhere. There is a large pirate fleet (7 large ships) blockading the southern Aegean, and it looks like the Venetian fleet has gone to chase it.



<digression>
I now digress for a meta-discussion on fair vs. "gamey" tactics. This is now the 4th time (twice with Venice, twice with Turkey) that I've seen a fleet in a critical, strait-blocking position, run away to go chase some foe. The last time it happened to me with Venice, it was so boneheaded a move by them that I just couldn't find it in me to exploit it, and I altered my strategy accordingly. This time, I don't. Why? Well, (a) last time, they were at war, and the threat was tiny (4 galleys of mine) - it just made no sense at all to leave Venice to chase me. This time, they are at peace, and the threat is much larger and to their lifeline (trading in the Med) - it's still not a smart move, but not an unbelievably bonheaded one. (b) I did explore various options around this via saved-game reloads (about the only time I do saved-game reloads), and found that the AI routinely DOWs Venice and takes advantage of this if I don't - my generosity has limits! So, anyways, end of meta-discussion, back to the regular discussion.....
</digression>

War #18 - vs. Venice

I immediately order my infantry to force-march (too bad there's no force-marching in this game, but you know what I mean ), to the gates of Venice (luckily I still have military access from Austria), and the second they get to Treviso (owned by Austria), I DOW Venice - such a ripe plum is worth the stability hit, CB or no CB.

I barely make it into Venice before the Venetian fleet makes it back, and slams the door shut - they are too late! This works out very well for me, as a few months later Austria and the Papal states DOW Venice as well, but they are left to stew at the gates, while I am safely inside, chortle chortle.

My chortling is ruined in early 1494, as Lithuania caves to Poland, giving Poland several provinces - Poland is just amazing!

In July 1497, Venice falls! I debate whether to annex it, or vassalize it.
If I annex it, I get 100% of the COT income, not just 50%, and 100% of the province income, not 50%.
On the other hand, if I annex it, I get 0% of the income from Venetian traders, I get a bigger bad-boy hit, and now I would have to keep the straits of Venice safe, as the Venetian navy wouldn't come over with an annexation.

So, I decide on vassalization, with a huge cash transfusion to boot! Yay!



My little Venetian adventure over, I'm now back where I was at the end of the last post - surrounded by two powerful alliances (Milan, Bavaria, Bohemia) and (Austria, Poland, Byzantium), both at peace, neither of which I think I can defeat all by my lonesome.

I hatch a Cunning Plan
- Milan is the head of the HRE. If I DOW somebody with no alliances, but a member of the HRE (like Ferrara), I think it will pull in Milan, without giving Milan a chance to call for allies (forum readers: am I correct here?).

I start to wind up for this, deploying most of my forces near Italy, when, in November 1495, for the 3rd time this game, Poland DOWs me! The infernal fiends! And both Austria and Byzantium join in! (Magdeburg joins the party for some reason, as well). This is going to be my greatest challenge yet.

War #19 - vs. Poland, Austria, Byzantium, Magdeburg

Let's review the situation, as in the map below:



Hungary (me) has 51K level 9 troops, mostly cavalry. I have two large advantages: (1) interior lines, and (2) being a human - the AI in this game is good, but let's face it, it's just not the same thing.

Byzantium has only 10K level 7 troops. And they're ungrateful bastards . I could easily blast them first, and probably should do the

pull a von schlieffen and crush the byzantines then take on the poles

Click to expand...

option blsteen recommends), but unfortunately almost all of my army is way up by Italy - it will take months just to get down to Byzantium, and even then Byzantium has a lot of provinces (something like 8 on the mainland, and then some islands) - it could be a long time before I get them to surrender.

Poland has 36K level 7 troops, about 2/3 infantry. I'm sure I can beat them, but (a) they are the senior partner - if I make them sue for peace, it will end the entire war without giving me a chance to spank the others, and (b) they have a ton of provinces - it will be a race as to whether I can conquer them before Austria and Byzantium conquer me!

Austria has 26K level 10 (one more than me) trooops (the picture says 20K, it's wrong, sorry - it was 26K). A tough foe, but I think takeable. Two other reasons to focus on them first: (1) they have the fewest provinces of the three, and (2) my forces are nearest them, in fact they block my Italian forces.

So the game plan is to use part of my cavalry to hold off the Poles and Byzants, while most of the army tries to knock Austria out of the war. And here we go......

First of all, I immediately spend about $200 of my Venetian booty and launch a massive army-building and general-recruiting effort - I'm in it to win it!

In the SOUTH, a 9K Byzant force seiges Macedonia. I leave it be - too many other fires to fight.

In the EAST, a 10K polish force starts moving towards Budapest. It's mostly infantry, I decide to send my 12K big, king-led, all-cavaly stack against it - and to my astonishment ....
I obliterate it! I don't know if this because I'm 2 tech levels up, or my army prestige, or my leader, or all of the above, but I'll take it!

This is confirmed as I then move the stack to the northwest, against a 5K Polish infantry stack, and again get an easy victory - it looks like Poland is a paper tiger!

I get another piece of good news in March, as Nogai (basically the Golden Horde) DOWs Poland - how does it feel, fellas? .

In the WEST, against Austria, it's quite a tussle. Austria has two stacks, each about 12K big, each mostly cavalry. I find, through painful experience, that they are quite tough! They are one technology level above me, I think this is making a big difference. They beat me a few times when they are together, I beat them (barely) a few times when they are seperate. The 'good news' in this is that while we're going at near Venice and the Tyrol, the Austrian leaves eastern Austria totally undefended - I quickly start seiging the eastern half of Austria.

In a crucial battle in February, I barely beat one of the two Austrian stacks , which I hope will get the ball rolling on whittling that stack to zero. I unite my forces into one big stack and give chase.....

Then a whole bunch of things happen in quick succession:

In late May, I get a 5-star advisor who makes my forts stronger - seems just the thing!

Then, in June, Byzantium offers me a white peace. I decide to accept - wihle Byzantium is nothing more than a nuisance, I feel like I have my hands full with the other two, and also my war exhaustion is steadily climbing. I just kept thinking, "pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered"

Then, right after that, I blast the Poles, obliterating a 12K stack at the cost of 58 soldiers! - if I would have been sure that Poland was such a paper tiger, I might have kept Byzantium in the war. Oh well.

Now we're up to August (boy the fur has been flying) - my huge stack meets the huge Austrian stack .... and loses . I barely lost on the morale, but get smacked pretty hard on the casualties.

We basically wind up in a standoff, where the two Austrian armies stay together in the Tyrol, where I leave them alone. When they leave, which they thankfully try with only one stack, I beat them back.

The month after that, France somehow gets an amazing laundry list of nations to DOW it - check it out, France is at war with: "Austria, Brandenburg, Burgundy, England, Milan, Switzerland, Pomerania, Paltainate, Alsace, Trier, Baden, Bremen, Brunswick, Hesse, Cologne". Two pieces of good news for me here, as anything more to worry Austria is fine by me, and anything that keeps Milan busy is even better - I spend this entire war worried about a Milanese backstab.

So here's the Austrian situation in September 1496:



The nearly-full-strength Austrian army is caged in the Tyrol. 5 of Austria's 8 provinces have fallen. I decide now's a good time to demand peace - it could take a long time to take all 8 provinces, I'm not even sure I can defeat the Austrian army at all, and the other 2 provinces are just being seiged at 0% and 13% - seems like we're at the point of diminishing returns. Also, I want to slam Poland before it gets a chance to regenerate, and before Milan gets a chance to intervene.



I get peace which rips the heart of Austria, splitting it in two, giving me another gold province and two other good provinces to boot - yeah baby! That's what happens when you mess with Hungary!

My war exhaustion has now reached the point where I am offered the "Liberum Veto" - gives me a lot more army units, at the cost of more decentralization. I decide to pass up the offer, as it looks like my army is quite sufficient, thank you!

I now turn all eyes on Poland - it's clobbering time!

Well, all eyes but one - in addition to Austria, Poland, and Byzantium, little Magdeburg also joined in against me - they must be taught a lesson! I ask my only ally in Europe, Brandenburg, for access, and they grant it - I send an expeditionary force towards them.

We're now up to October 1496 - note the war score below in the war against Poland, even though I haven't yet seiged, let alone taken, a single Polish province - that's all from battles.



The campaign against Poland is only limited by how fast my seiges can proceed, as Poland lies prostrate before me - amazing.

While this is happening, more good news:

in November 1496, I am told that Milan is at war with Bavaria - wonderful news, as not only does it make a Milanese backstab even less likely, but it means the Milanese-Bavarian alliance is now broken.

In September 1497, I vassalize Brandenburg, getting a huge cash payment from them to boot!



In December 1497, just before my triumph over Poland is complete, my wonderful king dies - what a reign he had! The new king is also quite good, , and has the nice added bonus that this change lifts the excommunication - hope _that_ doesn't happen for a 3rd time!

In January 1498, I have conquered all of Poland but 2 (1 conquered by Nogai, one still holding out), the war score is at 99%, time to bring Poland to heel!

This time, 'bad boy' be damned, I want to make sure Poland is smashed for good.

So I take 4 provinces from them: 2 good provinces in the North, Breslau and Sieradz, 1 in the middle (Bessarabia), and one in the South (Wallachia). Why these four? Because they cut Poland into 3 pieces! That'll teach you!



As Poland is still at war with Nogai, I figure the southern part will be ceded or revolt soon as well.

So here's the map of Greater Hungary in January 1498 - my reputation is now "slightly tarnished", and getting 7 provinces in the last year also means I have lots of rebellions to worry about. I plan to take a few years to let things settle down, let my war exhaustion recede, let my stability get back up (it's still at +1), and then it's back on the warpath!