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A BETA-preview Barbarossa AAR

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Xendance said:
LOL, Hanko is HUEG :D
Also, wtf is Kimito? And iirc, Inkoo is just some small swedish county/town, I have no idea why it's on the hoi 3 map :|
And why is Turku and it's archipelago written in swedish? Last time I checked HOI 3 was done in english (unless there are language packs)
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It's just a beta. ;)

I'm sure they have fixed this for release version. Ie. we will get Borgå instead of Porvoo, Helsingfors instead of Helsinki, Hangö instead of Hanko etc... :)

Kimito is Kemiö in svenska apperantly.
 
What I don't get is, USSR has 220 IC. An infantry division costs 11 IC. So at a stretch the USSR can build maybe 14 infantry at any one time, and if it takes 120 days to build one division, that means the USSR can mobilise a totally underwhelming 42 divs a year or 160 odd from 1941-45. Of 9,000 men each.

So the massive mobilisation the Soviet Union went through after the loss of millions of men, a mobilisation that put tens of millions into uniform, is reduced to less than 1.5 million and totally - pulls the rug from under - the USSR while also not even being a little bit historical. I'm a bit... disappointed?
 
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Väinö I said:
It's just a beta. ;)

I'm sure they have fixed this for release version. Ie. we will get Borgå instead of Porvoo, Helsingfors instead of Helsinki, Hangö instead of Hanko etc... :)

Kimito is Kemiö in svenska apperantly.
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Stop making fun of it, it's a serious matter! :p

Tried to google Kimito, apparently the whole county doesn't exist anymore. It merged with the Kimitoön (Kemiö Island) county.

Anyway, most of those names don't make any sense to me. I know it's hard to get every name in the world 100% correct, but swedish names instead of english or finnish names? :D
 
Oh, my finger tickle... Need... Game...... NOW.......
 
Alexus said:
What I don't get is, USSR has 220 IC. An infantry division costs 11 IC. So at a stretch the USSR can build maybe 14 infantry at any one time, and if it takes 120 days to build one division, that means the USSR can mobilise a totally underwhelming 42 divs a year or 160 odd from 1941-45. Of 9,000 men each.

So the massive mobilisation the Soviet Union went through after the loss of millions of men, a mobilisation that put tens of millions into uniform, is reduced to less than 1.5 million and totally fucks the USSR over while also not even being a little bit historical. I'm a bit... disappointed?
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1. Beta
2. Doctrines (maybe ?) lower IC costs of units
3. Practical experience lowers build time
4. Industrial technologies increace IC (and lower build time ?)
 
Alexus said:
What I don't get is, USSR has 220 IC. An infantry division costs 11 IC. So at a stretch the USSR can build maybe 14 infantry at any one time, and if it takes 120 days to build one division, that means the USSR can mobilise a totally underwhelming 42 divs a year or 160 odd from 1941-45. Of 9,000 men each.

So the massive mobilisation the Soviet Union went through after the loss of millions of men, a mobilisation that put tens of millions into uniform, is reduced to less than 1.5 million and totally fucks the USSR over while also not even being a little bit historical. I'm a bit... disappointed?
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Every time a division breaks, it is reformed at the capital with almost no strength. Then it is reinforced and sent into battle to break again. And again. And again.

I kinda like that. You get to spend all your IC and manpower rebuilding shattered divisons, rather than making new ones.
 
Baneslave said:
1. Beta
2. Doctrines (maybe ?) lower IC costs of units
3. Practical experience lowers build time
4. Industrial technologies increace IC (and lower build time ?)
Click to expand...

I'll throw in lengthy serials as another way of drastically reducing build time (at least in HOI2). Looking at things from a "the soviets have this much IC, infantry divisions cost this much IC and take this long to build, wtf" perspective the same problem applied in HOI2 and neither the AI nor the human player had any difficulty building the red army up to ahistorically vast sizes. This is the least of my concerns (with the greatest being, as always, AI).
 
Xendance said:
Seriously, get maps with english text, I almost find it insulting that every county name in Finland is written in swedish :p
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Sorry for the off-topic: But why on Earth you find it insulting? Those are the oldest and most well-established written names for those places and can be easily changed anyway, actually all those towns were founded by the Swedes and are still known with those names in addition to the Finnish ones even today. And as you can see they have used Swedish names only in Swedish-speaking coastal regions, Lappeenranta is still Lappeenranta just like the rest of the completely Finnish areas.
 
Karelian said:
Sorry for the off-topic: But why on Earth you find it insulting? Those are the oldest and most well-established written names for those places and can be easily changed anyway, actually all those towns were founded by the Swedes and are still known with those names in addition to the Finnish ones even today. And as you can see they have used Swedish names only in Swedish-speaking coastal regions, Lappeenranta is still Lappeenranta just like the rest of the completely Finnish areas.
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Because I'm a finn, that's why :p
We, finns, and the swedes have this love-hate relationship.

On topic: There's no reason to write those names in swedish. Either in english or in the language that's used in that specific country to which the county/city belongs. In Finland's example it's just weird to use the swedish names.
 
Karelian said:
I´m also curious to find out how long your longest battle has lasted so far?
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Currently the longest one was the battle of Riga which lasted something like three weeks. It was a massive afair.

I have played on into August and came to the conclusion the starting army of the Soviets is too large and too powerfull (you will see some screenies of the exact size later on). I have good confidence I will be able to keep the Germans from shattering my forces west of the Dnjepr and perhaps even from driving me back behind it. Some quite interesting actions have taken place amongst which three encirclemtent battles and an interesting counterattack from my side. I will tell you about the first phase of the later one tomorrow. The encirclement battle on the central front will be after that.

Experienced my first CTD in the 2nd week of August and I doubt if I will get any futher altough I will of course try to do so. Even if I don't I have enough to write about until the release of the demo (if any...., I don't know....).
 
How does the combined arms bonus work? Is it the same 1hard 2soft(or the opposite) brigades? Does the support brigade counts toward it? For example an SP art counts as an hard unit, etc.
 
Singleton Mosby said:
Currently the longest one was the battle of Riga which lasted something like three weeks. It was a massive afair.

I have played on into August and came to the conclusion the starting army of the Soviets is too large and too powerfull (you will see some screenies of the exact size later on). I have good confidence I will be able to keep the Germans from shattering my forces west of the Dnjepr and perhaps even from driving me back behind it. Some quite interesting actions have taken place amongst which three encirclemtent battles and an interesting counterattack from my side. I will tell you about the first phase of the later one tomorrow. The encirclement battle on the central front will be after that.
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How many brigades do the starting divisions have? From the discussion on these forums, it should not be more than 3 - either 3 inf or 2 inf and 1 other.

Makes an interesting way to balance forces, if starting Italian Divisions have 2 brigades, Russia 3, Germany 4.
 
Alexus said:
What I don't get is, USSR has 220 IC. An infantry division costs 11 IC. So at a stretch the USSR can build maybe 14 infantry at any one time, and if it takes 120 days to build one division, that means the USSR can mobilise a totally underwhelming 42 divs a year or 160 odd from 1941-45. Of 9,000 men each.

So the massive mobilisation the Soviet Union went through after the loss of millions of men, a mobilisation that put tens of millions into uniform, is reduced to less than 1.5 million and totally fucks the USSR over while also not even being a little bit historical. I'm a bit... disappointed?
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yeah man but this is 1941, presumably events, doctrines, laws etc will lower the cost/increase IC over time
 
Thank you Mosby for this AAR. It is a great sneak peak. :D

Have you any insights to share as to a proper size for units above the division level? As far as I have understood (but I could be wrong) you are no longer bound to the 3-9-12 divisions formations of HoI2, correct? And, this being the case, what is your take on proper size of formations?

The OOB used by many in WWII with two divisions forming a corps and two such corps forming an army seems a bit too small for the HoI series, given the available number of leaders etc.
 
Great AAR, but I really must point out that it's really unrealistic to have Hanko as such a large province with possibilities to attack from/to four nearby provinces, including Turku/Åbo Finland's second largest city at the time (lost Viipuri excluded). In reality it's a small peninsular some 10-15km wide. Historically it was insignificant to the Soviets after Barbarossa began.

Paradox must fix Hanko so that's its neighbouring only one province and not four!

Check out the real Hanko base here:
http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiedosto:Hangon_vuokra-alueen_kartta.jpg
 
Mad King said:
Paradox must fix Hanko so that's its neighbouring only one province and not four!
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While I agree with you, I think that it is bit hard to represent. Paradox would have to make really small province for representing this, thus giving a reason for everybody else to complain about missing military bases around the world. I honestly think, that it would be better to leave Hanko unrepresented.
 
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Mad King said:
Great AAR, but I really must point out that it's really unrealistic to have Hanko as such a large province with possibilities to attack from/to four nearby provinces, including Turku/Åbo Finland's second largest city at the time (lost Viipuri excluded). In reality it's a small peninsular some 10-15km wide. Historically it was insignificant to the Soviets after Barbarossa began.

Paradox must fix Hanko so that's its neighbouring only one province and not four!

Check out the real Hanko base here:
http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiedosto:Hangon_vuokra-alueen_kartta.jpg
Click to expand...

Well we don't even know yet if they have fixed it. The demo for the AAR is a quite old one.
 
Historically the Soviets didn't even try to keep Hanko and given the frontage system I can't see how the base would even be worth trying to maintain with only a year at most to do anything with the province. Unless someone tries to game the system and do a zerg rush?

I'd like to see how the Finns do in a winter war scenario in HoI3. As I recall in HoI2 they would just get steamrolled.
 
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