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Thread: We Three Kings - an MP AAR

  1. #41
    Enewald Enewald's Avatar
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    Boars in north Africa?
    Friendly fire can also be less friendly and mortal sometimes it seems.

  2. #42
    Crusader for Fun and Profit Murmurandus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BiB View Post
    Most excellent read.
    Indeed it is...
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  3. #43
    Enjoyable AAR you have here. It's good to see that at least someone is trying to fill empty space where Rome MP AAR should have been, I also, have already picked sides and will root for Egyptian arms, may they crush Seleucid and Pontus alike.

  4. #44
    Zealot Crybaby Troll Jarkko Suvinen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edzako View Post
    I also, have already picked sides and will root for Egyptian arms, may they crush Seleucid and Pontus alike.
    Wohoo! Today I'll get the next part of the Egyptian story done
    I prefer the term differently rational.

  5. #45
    In the lands of Calradia Wyvern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edzako View Post
    I also, have already picked sides and will root for Egyptian arms, may they crush Seleucid and Pontus alike.
    A man of little taste or judgement
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  6. #46
    Zealot Crybaby Troll Jarkko Suvinen's Avatar
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    Eternal Egypt: 585-599
    - The Reign of Ptolemy V Epiphanes, part III -


    The golden age of Egypt has been said to begun in 585 after the Seleucid war of Ptolemy V had been waged. Some historians have pointed out that while it is true Egypt was by then the leading nation in technology and arts alike, and that the external impetus of Egypt was closing the peak, the fact is that Egypt was internally torn. Despite the two decades of prosperous times under Ptolemy V, many inside Egypt saw him still unfit to lead the glorious nation.

    Philocrates Ahmid had a final fallout with Ptolemy in 588. Ptolemy ordered Philocrates to Alexandria, but Philocrates replied that Ptolemy should come to Crete if there is a need for words. Both began rallying loyal nobles and troops to their flags, but then all of the sudden in October 589 Philocrates died to a plague running rampart in Crete that autumn. Philocrates was 43 years old when he died, and was practically leading a nation within the nation of Egypt.

    When the word of Philocrates' death reached Alexandria, Ptolemy has been said to have at first been overly in joy, but then burst into cries. Without the support of Philocrates in the past 30 years Ptolemy would have lost his crown and head a long time ago. A month long mourning time was declared in Egypt, because "the hero of Egypt has passed to Osiris". The Ahmid family saw its members elevated in several political positions (including several marriages between the Ptolemy and Ahmid families).

    Egypt began a massive naval program during the last decade of the century. Not only were ships oredered to be built in vast numbers, but the ships also had the latest innovations (such as archer platforms, which was another brilliant egypttian invention later on copied into many other ships in the Mediterranean area) and were ornamented beauties. Where ever the Egyptian fleets visited, people were awestruck by the massive fleet and the majesty of the ships.

    The heir to the throne, Amyrteos Ptolemy, was named as the chancellor in the court. It is said his skills would have rather been as a military commander, but the pharaoh wanted Amyrteos to become familiar with the court policies. The pharaoh knew from personal experience how dangerous it could be if the pharaoh was inexperienced in handling the court, and thus wanted to see his son to avoid that trap.

    Tensions within the Egypt court were constantly rising. Finally in 591 tensions were so high, that pharaoh Ptolemy informed of new organisations within the court. Amongst others the royal treasurer and the polemarchos were replaced because of "grand ineptude". In fact, Ptolemy used so harsh language at his opponents at the court it is believed he attempted on purpose to provocate the disloyal members of his court. His plan were succesfull, as in April 591 no less than eleven nobles from various posts in the governement informed their intention to replace Ptolemy.

    The rebels hailed Leonidas Zosimid (a former general of the Western army) as the new pharaoh. The civil war tore families apart. For example Charias and Aratos Zosimid, the two sons of Leonidas Zosimid, remained loyal to Ptolemy.

    Initially the rebels saw many successes. Aratos Narivid, the latest commander of the 1st army joined the rebels. He has by many been likened to Alexander, Pyrrhus and Hannibal in military skill. The rebel armies under Aratos put Thebes and Memphis under siege, and threathened Alexandria itself. However, young and able generals were given the leadership of the loyalist armies, Psherenamum Ahmid and his brother Amyrteos Ahmid leading the two main armies while Kleitos Therid commanded the siege-corps which was able to decimate besieged fort defenses at unforeseen speed using the latest Egyptian inventions efficiently.



    In August 592 the army led by Psherenamum Ahmid totally destroyed the main rebel army in the second battle of Memphis. Finally after three years of fighting the rebels did surrender in July 594. Eight of the rebel leaders were captured and cast into irons. It is interesting to notice that most were later pardoned and called to service Egypt again, and especially Aratos Narivid served Egypt loyally in the coming years.

    Before, during and after the civil war the barbarians from Corniclanum raided several times into Egyptian lands. In 597 Ptolemy sent the Western army to finally destroy the barbarians. A permanent fort was raised, and the barbarians were totally pacified during the next two decades.

    In court Amyrteos Ptolemy was often very submissive in front of older court members, perhaps the result of his strongwilled father. To apparently put some back-bone into his son, the pharaoh gave command of the main fleet to his son during the civil war. He was an able military commander, altough his sceptisism towards new ideas sometimes did cause problematic situations. Amyrteos had read everything about Alexander the Great and of the strategies of the first Ptolemy, and he firmly believed nothing could possibly be done better than had been completed in those days.


    While Egypt focused on internal affairs, Pontus went on an annexing spree in the Seleucid land. At one point it did look like Pontus would eat up all of the Seleucids, but after pharaoh Ptolemy inquired about the situations, the Basileus modestly promised to back down. However, there seemed to be no peace between Pontus and Seleucids, and finally Ptolemy had no other choice but to send Egyptian troops to the historically Egyptian province of Lycia. The first Ptolemy was born in Lycia, and thus the very roots of Ptolemy was in this province. This police action finally seemed to drive the Basileus back to his senses for a while, and the Seleucid empire did continue to exist. Egypt had once again shown to her neighbours it can be perilous to ignore the will of the pharaoh of Egypt!


    The world in 599
    Last edited by Jarkko Suvinen; 08-07-2009 at 00:03.
    I prefer the term differently rational.

  7. #47
    Enewald Enewald's Avatar
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    Amyrteus wants to become a cupbearer?
    WtF is that of an ambition?
    Dude, you're supposed to be a Pharaoh one day.

    Although he has kinda nice skills!

  8. #48
    Zealot Crybaby Troll Jarkko Suvinen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enewald View Post
    Amyrteus wants to become a cupbearer?
    WtF is that of an ambition?
    Dude, you're supposed to be a Pharaoh one day.

    Although he has kinda nice skills!
    Yeah... Sceptical, Submissive and Arbitrary are cool skills for a potential ruler However! The plot starts to thicken in the next and final part of the history of Ptolemy V. Why is it always those Cruel 3-1-2 rulers that live the longest time?
    I prefer the term differently rational.

  9. #49
    Field Marshal Stuyvesant's Avatar
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    Well, idiot rulers do make for more interesting AARs... Plus, so far you seem to be doing rather well, occasional major civil war notwithstanding.

    Since you already seem to have picked up a groupie, I'll start rooting for Wyvern and his poor, much-maligned Pontus. So, here goes: keep your hands of Pontus, you bad, bad man! Or else... Well, else the Prof might backstab you (the core of your territory is closer to Numidia than to Pontus, after all).

  10. #50
    the Conqueror Peter Ebbesen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enewald View Post
    Boars in north Africa?
    Would you doubt the sworn word of Gulussa Massinid?

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    These things happen. A regrettable accident.
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  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Stuyvesant View Post
    Since you already seem to have picked up a groupie, I'll start rooting for Wyvern and his poor, much-maligned Pontus. So, here goes: keep your hands of Pontus, you bad, bad man! Or else... Well, else the Prof might backstab you (the core of your territory is closer to Numidia than to Pontus, after all).

    Much-maligned ? When has Eternal Egypt ever told lies about it's mediocre northern neighbor ? I do remember Pharaoh declaring war on Pontus behalf and practically gifting Macedonian province to Pontus, despite the fact that expanding like kid with an excess of growth hormone

  12. #52
    In the lands of Calradia Wyvern's Avatar
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    Secret History of Pontus: 585-599
    - The Lycia incident -


    “I apologise children that todays lesson can’t be more interesting; as it’s sunny outside I’ll try and keep things short and to the point so we can all have an early lunch.

    “Today we are going to cover Pontus from the year 585 to the end of the century. Not a very interesting period for the most part I must admit, until that is things really hot up in the last five years, and I’m sure you all know what I’m referring to there if you did your homework.

    “That’s right I'm talking about – Lycia!

    “Who can forget Lycia when studying a history of Pontus and Egypt. It was there that the first real cracks appeared in the friendship between the two kingdoms, a friendship that had been forged to resist the Seleucid Empire. It was there that in 599 whilst Egypt witnessed the utter defeat of the Seleucid’s by Pontus’ armies that they decided to use that war as an opportunity to annex the province of Lycia, right in Pontus’ back yard.

    “From the historical record we know that ostensibly the two kingdoms remained allied for a while afterwards, at least on paper, after Lycia though it was a strained alliance at best with neither kingdom ever calling on the other for aid, but there I go rattling on about next weeks lesson rather than what we need to cover today, so let’s look at how the crisis came about.

    “After a decade or more at peace, in the year 595 Pontus declared war on the Seleucid Empire, slowly driving them out of Asia Minor and by 599 occupying half of all Seleucid lands. The utter defeat of the Seleucid’s in this war is generally acknowledged as the start of the collapse of that once great state. Pontus would annex both Pergamon and Antioch for her troubles, two of the richest cities of the region, and together they would cement her position as a rising, if still culturally backward power.

    “We are lucky enough to have a number of army ledgers survive from the time and they record the number of troops and reinforcements employed by Pontus. From these we can estimate that Pontus committed between 100,000 and 150,000 men to the war all told over the space of those 5 years, which was a massive undertaking for the small kingdom Pontus was at the time. They also show that the army was recieving no more than 900 reinforcements a month and that by the end of 599 the countries manpower had been bled dry.

    “When we go back to look at Egyptian actions in 599 we see now why she felt safe in sending troops to occupy Lycia, wrestling it from a rebel Seleucid lord as Pontus was powerless to action beyond the vociferous diplomatic complaints she sent to Egypt, copies of which are preserved even today in the Memphis scrolls.

    “There are a number of scrolls documenting the diplomatic back and forths of both sides over Lycia. Let’s take a look at the first one, dated early 599.”
    Quote Originally Posted by ”Memphis scroll circa early 599: Subject Lycia”
    King Pharnaces of Pontus:
    Great Ptolemy, kindly respect the Greek nationality of the province called Lycia that your soldiers are currently marching on. We respect your desire to destroy the Seleucid Rebels, however remember that Lycia comes under Pontus’ sphere of influence, not Egypts.

    King Ptolemy’s reply:
    Lycia has been, is, and will remain a core province of Egypt. How would the king of Pontus feel if Egypt in a similar whimsical manner did claim one of the core provinces of Pontus? Egypt will take back its core provinces, and there is no bullying around that.

    Addendum: Now that’s interesting, the Lycian’s no longer consider themselves a core of Egypt after all. Well, that will be corrected soon.
    “From the wording of King Pharnaces message we can see Pontus is clearly the junior of the two kingdoms. Her message is strong but gives full respect to the Egyptian ruler. Egypts reply however is rather curious. It is hard to tell if the extra message tagged onto the end was for King Pharnaces eyes or not. Either way we can see Egypt taking a very beligerant stance over Lycia.”

    “Here's the next scroll. Everyone please take a few moments to read it before we go on.”

    Quote Originally Posted by ”Memphis scroll circa late 599: Subject Lycia”
    King Pharnaces of Pontus:
    We were happy to recieve your reply and the acknowledgement from your ambassador that Lycia is in fact not an Egyptian core, and so we are sure you’ll agree that Egyptian has no reason to try and conquer it except to try and build a larger area of territory on Pontus' border, something you would only want to do if you had evil intentions, which we are sure you haven’t. The Lycian people cry out to join their cultural cousins who are NOT and never have been Egytian.
    King Ptolemy’s reply:
    Egypt went to war with the Seleucid rebels because

    a) half my court wanted a war with them
    b) Our soothsayers demand we get tribute from someone.
    c) Lycia has been a core of Egypt until very recently, and Lycia will be returned back to control of Egypt as the population there is screaming for.
    “Many historians have questioned the state of mind of Ptolemy at the time based on this scroll fragment alone, due to it coming across to a modern reader as slightly raving. However we must not judge the words of past rulers based on modern mores. In the ancient world rulers would invent the strangest of excuses to back up their claims and the power of the soothsayers I should point out was very strong in these times. Finally let’s look at the last surviving scroll covering this corespondence.”
    Quote Originally Posted by ”Memphis scroll circa 600: Subject Lycia”
    King Pharnaces of Pontus:
    I hate to break it to you my dear friend, but Lycia hasn't been an Egytian core in living memory. Not in my life time, and not in my fathers either.
    “There is no record of a reply from Egypt to this final message, unless one counts that of her soldiers who went on to wrestle the province from the Seleucid rebels.”
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  13. #53
    Crusader for Fun and Profit Murmurandus's Avatar
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    In the mean time Numidia is following this 'development' from the sideline with joy...
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  14. #54
    Enewald Enewald's Avatar
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    Strange the nowadays professionals are enough professional to use the Roman Republican calendar.

  15. #55
    the Conqueror Peter Ebbesen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murmurandus View Post
    In the mean time Numidia is following this 'development' from the sideline with joy...
    Given that Pontus and Egypt have generally had an easy time stripping rich and powerful provinces from the "practically always occupied by civil war" Seleucids in a series of generally cheap campaigns (though Pontus' early campaigns were expensive given Pontus' size), you betcha. That said, from a neutral point of view, it is clear that the Egyptians are being treacherous as usual. Lycia full of Egyptians asking for liberation by Egypt? Cornuclanum, the 'empty' border province between Numidia and Egypt colonised on a whim? The Pharaoh sure knows how to behave diplomatically.
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  16. #56
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    Train wreck in slow motion. This continues to be very entertaining, on all sides involved.

  17. #57
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    Color me entertained.

    Vann
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  18. #58
    Zealot Crybaby Troll Jarkko Suvinen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Ebbesen View Post
    said, from a neutral point of view, it is clear that the Egyptians are being treacherous as usual. Lycia full of Egyptians asking for liberation by Egypt? Cornuclanum, the 'empty' border province between Numidia and Egypt colonised on a whim? The Pharaoh sure knows how to behave diplomatically.
    Lycia was a historical part of Egypt, and it became a core again soon after the status had been missing (for whatever reason) for a short period. I do not see anything problematic with that. To Egypt what to Egypt rightfully belongs.

    Regarding Corniclanum (sp?), it was you yourself who pointed out (in game chat) I must have been enjoying all the barbarian uprisings there. The barbarians always did head out towards Egypt (did you have a single incursion to Numidian lands?), and I can bet you were snickering having succeeded to fool Egypt into accepting it should "remain neutral for the time being" Anyway, the "time being" went away, and so did the barbarians who all became loyal citizens of Egypt.
    I prefer the term differently rational.

  19. #59
    Zealot Crybaby Troll Jarkko Suvinen's Avatar
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    Peter, should I revert to bad poetry again? I am starting to forget those early sessions
    I prefer the term differently rational.

  20. #60
    the Conqueror Peter Ebbesen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarkko Suvinen View Post
    Peter, should I revert to bad poetry again? I am starting to forget those early sessions
    Nope. I told you yesterday that I would get an AAR entry up today, and I still fully expect to fulfill my promise.

    ...so quit yer bellyaching until tomorrow.
    Finally got around to writing a list of my AARs in the inkwell.
    For those interested in Dominions 4 (SP or MP), we organize the Wrinkletoes games and answer general questions related to the game in this thread.
    Current ongoing Wrinkletoes 3 Dom4 game's list of players: linky.

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