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  1. #321
    General orwell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helius View Post
    SRI makes the chance for Kings to die in battle lower.
    Was that a change in the defines file, or did you go further and if so, how?
    Even an ignorant, paranoid, cowardly, ugly, corrupt, unsociable, aristocratic thug can conquer large parts of the world, kill thousands of people and be celebrated as the saviour of the Republic.

  2. #322
    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    Also is there a reason BRA is excluded from forming prussia in the decisions file?
    Look in prussia.txt, form_kingdom_of_prussia!
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  3. #323
    Quote Originally Posted by orwell View Post
    Was that a change in the defines file, or did you go further and if so, how?
    Defines is all we have, as modders, to influence this; and that's where I made a change.
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  4. #324
    Field Marshal Don_Quigleone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helius View Post
    Look in prussia.txt, form_kingdom_of_prussia!
    Ah, I see now, maybe it should be moved to prussiannation.txt for consistency?

  5. #325
    Those are vanilla files, no idea why they created two separate ones.
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  6. #326
    Corporal Aeven's Avatar
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    Helius, will you be adding Italy to the list of kingdoms in the next update? And maybe add a decision to be a Kingdom (or Empire) based on size (no spontaneous downgrading though) or prestige? I always hate losing that lovely Emperor title simply because I adopt Administrative Monarchy (quite often becoming a Duchy too, when playing the Byzantines for example).

  7. #327
    I thought Italy already was, in this version. The Byzantine Empire will get a special status as an Empire, no matter what (except as a Republic), in the next.
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  8. #328
    Corporal Aeven's Avatar
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    Would the same be true for the Ottomans and the Timurids? Or not? Considering historically the Padishah title did become Sultan.

    Also, perhaps the Byzantine Empire as a republic could use Roman titles such as Consul? (I'd love a tiny bit more detail to the Byzantines. Byzantophiles across these forums it seems)
    Last edited by Aeven; 02-06-2009 at 22:08.

  9. #329
    The Ottomans, whom I am currently playing, do go from Padishah to Sultan, which sounds right, to me.
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  10. #330
    Field Marshal Don_Quigleone's Avatar
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    In the war of the league of Province name it seems all the AIs seem to respond the exact same way, this might be fixed if the response events were staggered or something.

  11. #331
    Reichsmarschall Paradox Dev Team Darkrenown's Avatar
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    Speaking of "The War of the League of $PROVINCENAME$", I'm fighting it right now and there seems to be a problem with it: I'm leader of the opposition, the Emperor is Bavaria. I've crushed him and occupied every province. I have 100% WS. But my modifier is still "Indecisive", in fact, it has been for the whole war aside form one point when it went to "opposition advantage", but then BAV absorbed one of the OPMs I'd occupied and it went back to indecisive.
    Relentless madman.

  12. #332
    Reichsmarschall Paradox Dev Team Darkrenown's Avatar
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    So I made peace then fought a 2nd war, which got me to Likely oppostion victory. I made peace again, but then Castile (Allied to France) decided to support the Emperor which started a new war. Amusingly enough, Bavaria (Emp) dishonoured their alliance and aren't even fighting me.
    Relentless madman.

  13. #333
    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    In the war of the league of Province name it seems all the AIs seem to respond the exact same way, this might be fixed if the response events were staggered or something.
    They don't always do that. The underlying seed for random decisions will be the same, true; but each nation has different ai-chance-modifiers applied to it that depend on circumstances.
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  14. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrenown View Post
    So I made peace then fought a 2nd war, which got me to Likely oppostion victory. I made peace again, but then Castile (Allied to France) decided to support the Emperor which started a new war. Amusingly enough, Bavaria (Emp) dishonoured their alliance and aren't even fighting me.
    Hard to control; but it seems to make sense, if Bavaria had just been beaten pretty severely.

    As for the likely outcome of the war, warscore is NOT the crucial measure.
    The underlying factors have to do with battles, sieges, provinces owned, and also official warscore. Usually, one war is not enough to create a decisive outcome, either way (see manual, p. 52-53).
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  15. #335
    Field Marshal Don_Quigleone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helius View Post
    They don't always do that. The underlying seed for random decisions will be the same, true; but each nation has different ai-chance-modifiers applied to it that depend on circumstances.
    This should be true, but either way every time I trigger it (and I've done it a fair few times now) every AI chooses the same option.

    Another thing that needs to be examined is what happens if a new emperor is elected during this chain and is of a different religion. I got several weird results.

    1. Initially the Catholics held the crown, and chose no tolerance, then a Protestant was elected, chose to continue no tolerance, but the Protestants ended out forming the league.
    2. The Emp was force converted during the war, and almost immediately afterwards the leader of the league was elected Emperor, and then both a victory and defeat message was shown.

    I have a few ideas for improvements:

    1. Have the membership of the league grow in a more "staggered" manner. Historically countries joined the league over a period of several years. Perhaps it should be decision based?
    2. Membership of the league should mostly manifest in a string of independence guarantees, these are harder to get rid of, and the league was mostly defensive in nature (from my limited reading). It should only move to a full alliance once battle is fully underway.
    3. The Emperor should try and gather Allies more actively before he confronts the league. He should only go against the league if he's powerful enough to do so. In my games the Emperor, despite holding a rather large Empire, was soundly defeated just because he was swamped and unprepared, in one game he was also in a war with France, historically the Emperor Charles delayed fighting the league as he was engaged in hostilities with the French. Either way the AI is forced to declare war on the league in too much of a "brute force" approach.
    4. The AI should be more stubborn when fighting, the AI peaces out way too easily. Though admittedly the Emperor did get swamped with half the nations of the Empire swamping him completely.
    Last edited by Don_Quigleone; 04-06-2009 at 03:05.

  16. #336
    Reichsmarschall Paradox Dev Team Darkrenown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helius View Post
    As for the likely outcome of the war, warscore is NOT the crucial measure.
    The underlying factors have to do with battles, sieges, provinces owned, and also official warscore. Usually, one war is not enough to create a decisive outcome, either way (see manual, p. 52-53).
    The manual isn't clear that it may require more than one war. For the 30years war it's clear you may need several wars, but it's not mentioned for the League one.
    Last edited by Darkrenown; 04-06-2009 at 03:04.
    Relentless madman.

  17. #337
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrenown View Post
    The manual isn't clear that it may require more than one war. For the 30years war it's clear you may need several wars, but it's not mentioned for the League one.
    P. 53 of the current manual:

    If the two sides make peace while the war outcome is still indecisive, the leader of the opposition or the Emperor (whoever is ahead) will get an option to wait it out, go back to war, or offer an olive branch to the other camp.
    If an olive branch is accepted, a compromise will be the result: universal toleration, and the restoration of the Catholic bishoprics.
    If the parties fight on, the outcome score continues to be adjusted with every event in that war.

    The next time that the war has ended in a formal peace, the score will once again be evaluated, and the party that is ahead may once more decide what it wants to do – quit while they’re ahead, fight on for a more favorable outcome, or wait for a while before going back to war.
    A peace settlement can also come about as the result of the initiative of the Reichstag. If war exhaustion climbs too high, this chamber may force the end of the conflict by passing a Law that mandates the type of compromise outlined above, as the result of an olive branch.
    If a clear victor emerges, his options for imposing his will in a peace treaty are prescribed by his confession and the margin of his victory:
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  18. #338
    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    This should be true, but either way every time I trigger it (and I've done it a fair few times now) every AI chooses the same option.

    Another thing that needs to be examined is what happens if a new emperor is elected during this chain and is of a different religion. I got several weird results.

    1. Initially the Catholics held the crown, and chose no tolerance, then a Protestant was elected, chose to continue no tolerance, but the Protestants ended out forming the league.
    2. The Emp was force converted during the war, and almost immediately afterwards the leader of the league was elected Emperor, and then both a victory and defeat message was shown.
    This is a nightmare! I thought I had all those eventualities covered.
    I have to go back and check where I changed the code - maybe the current version contains outdated files.

    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    I have a few ideas for improvements:

    1. Have the membership of the league grow in a more "staggered" manner. Historically countries joined the league over a period of several years. Perhaps it should be decision based?
    2. Membership of the league should mostly manifest in a string of independence guarantees, these are harder to get rid of, and the league was mostly defensive in nature (from my limited reading). It should only move to a full alliance once battle is fully underway.
    3. The Emperor should try and gather Allies more actively before he confronts the league. He should only go against the league if he's powerful enough to do so. In my games the Emperor, despite holding a rather large Empire, was soundly defeated just because he was swamped and unprepared, in one game he was also in a war with France, historically the Emperor Charles delayed fighting the league as he was engaged in hostilities with the French. Either way the AI is forced to declare war on the league in too much of a "brute force" approach.
    4. The AI should be more stubborn when fighting, the AI peaces out way too easily. Though admittedly the Emperor did get swamped with half the nations of the Empire swamping him completely.
    1) I'll think about that.

    2) Can't mod guarantees.

    3) Will look at that.

    4) Can't mod that much, either, beyond the bonuses we already give.
    Mourning Magna Mundi

  19. #339
    Field Marshal Don_Quigleone's Avatar
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    On 2 and 4, I was mostly thinking you could mod this at the AI level, can you mod the AI to guarantee certain people? Likewise can the AI be modded to be stubborn? Though actually you mightn't need to make the AI to stubborn if you can avoid the Emperor from being swamped by hordes of Protestants.

    Would you like me to post save games if I do this stuff again? I have a good game saved at about 1520 or so, on the verge of these conflicts, I've already gone through the initial chain 2 or 3 times, I could go few it a few more times.

    Also, if you have the membership grow in a more staggered manner (and it should also include some rulers from outside the HRE, wasn't denmark historically a member?), you should have the main conflict trigger when it gets to some kind of "critical mass".

  20. #340
    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    On 2 and 4, I was mostly thinking you could mod this at the AI level, can you mod the AI to guarantee certain people?
    No, not directly. You can tell the AI to protect another country which may mean giving a guarantee (at least from my experience).

    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    Likewise can the AI be modded to be stubborn?
    Nope. Which is a real pitty. I've often thought about how handy this would be to modders, to be able to have the AI respond differently depending on what kind of conflict it's involved in. The lack of this is why you never experience a 30 years war (unless it's maybe fought by only giants like France or Spain). Most of the smaller states in the HRE fold and peace out very quickly in the games I played.

    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Quigleone View Post
    Also, if you have the membership grow in a more staggered manner (and it should also include some rulers from outside the HRE, wasn't denmark historically a member?), you should have the main conflict trigger when it gets to some kind of "critical mass".
    I don't think that Denmark were ever an official member of the Protestant Union, but the king of Denmark was also Duke of Holstein which was a member of the empire. So Denmark was somewhat more "naturally" involved than some other outsiders.

    Helius: I haven't had the pleasure (or time) to play your mod enough, but are there events that might drag ousiders like France, Sweden, Transylvania, etc. into the conflict?

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