Short Range not being a problem in the Pacific?
I don't know why but that strikes me as wrong for some reason.
I don't know why but that strikes me as wrong for some reason.
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The update says that short range is not a problem in Europe, but is a problem in the Pacific.
Trekaddict
Sounds like the guys were rather critical of the teeth the Edgehill was equipped with. Which sounds about right under the circumstances.
Good point about it being a moot point replacing the Spitfires with Mustangs. Might still need substantial numbers for operations against the Soviets if a bombing campaign was planned against them as the early jets were also pretty short-ranged. However most of Germany is probably now in range for the latter model Spits, especially with drop tanks.
Tube Alloys will take a hell of a long time to get started as I think it was about mid-43 OTL before the project started producing any actual nuclear material and that only initially in minute amounts.
Steve
Sounds like the guys were rather critical of the teeth the Edgehill was equipped with. Which sounds about right under the circumstances.
Good point about it being a moot point replacing the Spitfires with Mustangs. Might still need substantial numbers for operations against the Soviets if a bombing campaign was planned against them as the early jets were also pretty short-ranged. However most of Germany is probably now in range for the latter model Spits, especially with drop tanks.
Tube Alloys will take a hell of a long time to get started as I think it was about mid-43 OTL before the project started producing any actual nuclear material and that only initially in minute amounts.
Steve
I fear Dowding has been listening to his voices too much again (he was a spiritualist after all). Proposing a long term switch to Mustangs indeed, time for Park to take over and provide some sensible RAF leadership.
I completely support Kurtie in the MB.5 Mustang, that would be cool. I know it wont be, it's going to be another 'rescued from America' copy, but a man can dream hey?
Looks like the "GPO" tunnel schemes went ahead as OTL, it's a maze down there and large chunks are still classified. Makes avoiding them when planning a new one fun I can tell you!
I completely support Kurtie in the MB.5 Mustang, that would be cool. I know it wont be, it's going to be another 'rescued from America' copy, but a man can dream hey?
Looks like the "GPO" tunnel schemes went ahead as OTL, it's a maze down there and large chunks are still classified. Makes avoiding them when planning a new one fun I can tell you!
Kurt_Steiner Alas, no. Main reason are these new-fangled prop-less engines.
Agent Larkin Sh*t happens.
stevep The de-briefing officer made the mistake to ask for an honest assessment. So that's what he got.
The 'Stang (which I really learned to apprechiate after that Airshow I went to. Dear god the sound. The Merlin heritage of the engine was clearly audible.) and various versions of her will see extensive service as an escort fighter in Europe and as a general fighter in the Pacific.
Jets will at first be too short-ranged for escort duty there too, so the Mustang has a place. I can't say too much yet.
Here it will too take until summer 1945 until they can begin assembly of the first Nuke. They started production of the materials earlier (by about nine months) but the lower rate of production cancels this out. Engineering wise they follow the same routes but will concentrate on the Uranium Gun design (better known as Little Boy) because there they can produce it faster and technically wouldn't need to blow one as a test. (I'm still torn on wether to do it or not, mostly because I have trouble seeing anyone using a Nuclear Weapon without knowing if it'll set the atmosphere on fire or something).
Trinity IOTL was a design identical to the Fat Man design dropped on Nagasaki which due to being more complicated was feared might not work.
El Pip He isn't listening to the voices, he is quoting a paper floating around his part of the MoD before it gets to the PM's hands and creates the wrong impression. Dowding knows that the idea is stupid (We are talking about the British Ministry of Defence here after all ) but he wants the Jets instead too.
The Mustang will mostly replace the Mossie in the Escort Fighter role, Fighter Command's Air Superiority Squadrons (for lack of a better term) will fly the Spitfire until the Meteors and Vampires come.
I can see why those would be a problem. I was actually inspired by a documentary I saw many moons ago about a Soviet bunker in the Moscow Metro that was supposed to shelter the Polit bureau in time of crisis until they bugged out to that mountain retreat. Here it's just an ultra-secret meeting room that the principals of the British Government (and yes that would include the Regent and the Queen, though not on this meeting) can reach without being seen too much.
Agent Larkin Sh*t happens.
stevep The de-briefing officer made the mistake to ask for an honest assessment. So that's what he got.
The 'Stang (which I really learned to apprechiate after that Airshow I went to. Dear god the sound. The Merlin heritage of the engine was clearly audible.) and various versions of her will see extensive service as an escort fighter in Europe and as a general fighter in the Pacific.
Jets will at first be too short-ranged for escort duty there too, so the Mustang has a place. I can't say too much yet.
Here it will too take until summer 1945 until they can begin assembly of the first Nuke. They started production of the materials earlier (by about nine months) but the lower rate of production cancels this out. Engineering wise they follow the same routes but will concentrate on the Uranium Gun design (better known as Little Boy) because there they can produce it faster and technically wouldn't need to blow one as a test. (I'm still torn on wether to do it or not, mostly because I have trouble seeing anyone using a Nuclear Weapon without knowing if it'll set the atmosphere on fire or something).
Trinity IOTL was a design identical to the Fat Man design dropped on Nagasaki which due to being more complicated was feared might not work.
El Pip He isn't listening to the voices, he is quoting a paper floating around his part of the MoD before it gets to the PM's hands and creates the wrong impression. Dowding knows that the idea is stupid (We are talking about the British Ministry of Defence here after all
) but he wants the Jets instead too.The Mustang will mostly replace the Mossie in the Escort Fighter role, Fighter Command's Air Superiority Squadrons (for lack of a better term) will fly the Spitfire until the Meteors and Vampires come.
I can see why those would be a problem. I was actually inspired by a documentary I saw many moons ago about a Soviet bunker in the Moscow Metro that was supposed to shelter the Polit bureau in time of crisis until they bugged out to that mountain retreat. Here it's just an ultra-secret meeting room that the principals of the British Government (and yes that would include the Regent and the Queen, though not on this meeting) can reach without being seen too much.
You utter heathen!
I know. But RAF and RN have a policy that says that two-seat fighters are against policy.
Besides, the Mossie is fast and packs a wallop but she's not that much of a dogfighter.
you know the British really should try to get some large scale French revolt as not only would help the French in the South but stop any movement of troops from France to Austria and have the British tried to bomb Baku at all yet? Surely also in China seeing the large scale losses against the Russians, losses to the British in the south and Japanese losses to the East the Chinese maybe getting ready for some revolt as well
That part is going as per OTL, but it has been done so often and so to death I'm only mentioning it in passing.
They are prepping to bomb Baku, but Bomber Command is significantly smaller than OTL.
They are prepping to bomb Baku, but Bomber Command is significantly smaller than OTL.
But what about drop tanks on a Spit or, as Kurtie has nobly pointed out, the Martin Baker MB series, all of which had nice meaty fuel tanks.
If your insistent on someone in the Empire getting a plane then the CA-15 looks pretty good. It was already designed for a proper RR engine and had drop tanks as standard, plus surely Canada can't keep getting every non-British contract.
Problem with that is, unlike the MB5 and the CAC 15 (which I considered both) the Mustang is flying and available right now instead of flying in 1944/45 when TTL Gloster and De Havilland are taking over Supermarine shadow factories to produce the Meteor and the Vampire. The Mustang is the last piston-engine fighter the Royal Air Force is procuring ever, and frankly I've always been a follower of "good plane/ship/tank right now is better than excellent in two years.
Also I'd rather have Martin Baker producing ejector seats than planes. Yes, I am aware they didn't start doing that until 1946 and that they also use the last still operationally used Gloster Meteor for testing.
That said, the RAF is using droptanks on the Spitfire as the FAA is using them on the Seafire. Still, TTL the Spitfire is an Air Superiority Fighter, whilst the Mustang is meant as a high-altitude Escort Fighter.
You must also remember that OTL she sprang from a British Requirement.
Also I'd rather have Martin Baker producing ejector seats than planes. Yes, I am aware they didn't start doing that until 1946 and that they also use the last still operationally used Gloster Meteor for testing.
That said, the RAF is using droptanks on the Spitfire as the FAA is using them on the Seafire. Still, TTL the Spitfire is an Air Superiority Fighter, whilst the Mustang is meant as a high-altitude Escort Fighter.
You must also remember that OTL she sprang from a British Requirement.
Lots of things sprang from a requirement of the British government, British Rail for instance, doesn't make them right.
The MB.3 would be available on time (given the alt-history the prototype would get engines that wouldn't explode). If not something amusingly different like the Firebrand F.1 (the version that worked before the torpedo conversion buggered the Mk II). Still you appear set on it, much like Nuclear West Africa, so I suppose we will have to sigh and bear it. ( )
The MB.3 would be available on time (given the alt-history the prototype would get engines that wouldn't explode). If not something amusingly different like the Firebrand F.1 (the version that worked before the torpedo conversion buggered the Mk II). Still you appear set on it, much like Nuclear West Africa, so I suppose we will have to sigh and bear it. (
)
Let's not get into British Rail right now.
Anyhoo, you are right that the MB.3 would be available on time. However not only do I have a soft spot for the Mustang since the air show (after all, I am only human and seeing one of them fly by at full tilt not six metres away is...inspiring to say the least) but also that this is simply one of those cases where, to make things a tid more realistic, the powers that be don't always choose the best or 'correct' choice.
TTL's Mustang was designed around the Merlin to begin with and it's production variant (P-51B with all-British/Canadian internal equipment though, along with the Spitfire-style cockpit) has been tested against and found to be near 30 miles per hour faster than the MB3.
As for Nuclear West Africa, there are reasons why the British effort takes that long even though they totally ignore anything but the Uranium Gun design. Though admittedly when I wrote that I had researched the Manhatten Project but still failed to really grasp the size of it.
EDIT: I did just read on numerous sites that the disaster of the MB.3 was what pushed the company into Ejector seats, so we may have a case of "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" on our hands, as scary as that sounds...
EDIT EDIT: There's also the issue of the availability of pictures. There's loads of the Mustang III in British and Commonwealth service...
Anyhoo, you are right that the MB.3 would be available on time. However not only do I have a soft spot for the Mustang since the air show (after all, I am only human and seeing one of them fly by at full tilt not six metres away is...inspiring to say the least) but also that this is simply one of those cases where, to make things a tid more realistic, the powers that be don't always choose the best or 'correct' choice.
TTL's Mustang was designed around the Merlin to begin with and it's production variant (P-51B with all-British/Canadian internal equipment though, along with the Spitfire-style cockpit) has been tested against and found to be near 30 miles per hour faster than the MB3.
As for Nuclear West Africa, there are reasons why the British effort takes that long even though they totally ignore anything but the Uranium Gun design.
Though admittedly when I wrote that I had researched the Manhatten Project but still failed to really grasp the size of it.EDIT: I did just read on numerous sites that the disaster of the MB.3 was what pushed the company into Ejector seats, so we may have a case of "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" on our hands, as scary as that sounds...
EDIT EDIT: There's also the issue of the availability of pictures. There's loads of the Mustang III in British and Commonwealth service...
Rule Britannia, Britannia rules the waves... Britons never ever ever will be slaves.
BTW, in which update was the king killed. We really need a complete timeline of this AAR...
BTW, in which update was the king killed. We really need a complete timeline of this AAR...
what is FDR up to just wondering and Britain should try a Dieppe style raid in France to try and stop Germany transferring more troops to Austria and how much of Manchuria is Russian hands now?
From what I remember of previous updates, he's heading the American Government in Exile in [Toronto or Ottawa, I can't remember which].
Dieppe style? As a Canadian, I'm offended. Did you mean D-Day style?
Zeppelin247
I would agree with Viperhawk. Some commando style raids and encounraging resistance attacks probably, along with possibly some false intel on build ups but nothing like Dieppe. I.e. no attempt to capture a port or stay more than a few hours.
Steve
I would agree with Viperhawk. Some commando style raids and encounraging resistance attacks probably, along with possibly some false intel on build ups but nothing like Dieppe. I.e. no attempt to capture a port or stay more than a few hours.
Steve