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Thread: Against all Odds: The British Empire in World War Two

  1. #3481
    Colonel gaiasabre11's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Strange
    One, I use a fencing foil, which is a stabiing weapon and two, I'll think you'll find a longbow has slightly greater range than a spear. Plus, I'd like to see you put a spear through plate from a distance of several hundred metres!
    Lord Strange, do you seriously think that your longbow has more penetrating power (in terms of body mass penetration) than my spear in close ranges? (Long ranges don't really count in the field I'm talking about now.)

    Quote Originally Posted by El Pip View Post
    As the most manly Frenchman in history barely rates a "Danny La Rue" on the international manliness scale that's not a proud boast. It's much like being a tall midget; only an achievement relative to the abysmally low standards of one's unimpressive peers.
    Very well said, El Pip, but too bad it's nothing more than a string of your own delusions pieced together by pure jealousy.

    Back to the AAR: small question, when will you get to some North Africa scenes?
    Last edited by gaiasabre11; 19-09-2009 at 01:22.
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  2. #3482
    British Unionist trekaddict's Avatar
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    Griffin.Gen He was a very capable Speechwriter. The only one I like more than this one is 'We shall fight them on the beaches'. As for 'Agincourt', the Brits are extremely pissed at the French right now, so expect some more jibes later on.

    gaiasabre11 Authors prerogative methinks.

    Lord Strange Agreed. I can only point you to the first part of this post again.

    gaiasabre11&El Pip&Lord Strange This gets slightly disturbing....

    MadVlad Fixed. It's of course Imperial production. Alas, something else on the list. *writes it down*

    El Pip American production thing has been fixed. Other than that it is very much appropriate, only that this time the threat was not actual invasion but rather the vast Douhetian Bomber Fleets, which would have smashed everything.

    EDIT: As for Ian, he will stay desk bound for the time being, but I have at least two instances when he does go into the field anyway. Long-time plans.

    2nd Edit:

    gaiasabre11 North Africa... hrm. I have some other things to take care of, University starts on the first... It might be a bit. However, my plan is to start Market Garden by Christmas this year at the very latest.
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  3. #3483
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    Go Britain! Go Britain! Give me a B! , Give me an R, give me an I, give me a T, give me an A, give me an I, give me an N!!!

    What does that SAY!!!!!???

    Rule Britannia, Britannia rule the waves, Britons, never, never ever will be slaves!!!
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  4. #3484
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    Quote Originally Posted by trekaddict
    North Africa... hrm. I have some other things to take care of, University starts on the first... It might be a bit. However, my plan is to start Market Garden by Christmas this year at the very latest.
    University == fewer updates, at least that's how it works for me. But wouldn't you feel excited when you write about, like say El Alamein?

    Quote Originally Posted by Doge Robert View Post
    Go Britain! Go Britain! Give me a B! , Give me an R, give me an I, give me a T, give me an A, give me an I, give me an N!!!

    What does that SAY!!!!!???

    Rule Britannia, Britannia rule the waves, Britons, never, never ever will be slaves!!!
    Very well said. Seriously, I've to come up with my own chants for France to beat this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gaiasabre11 View Post
    Very well said. Seriously, I've to come up with my own chants for France to beat this.
    France? In this AAR? Oh my, you really do need some good chants... Magic even..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doge Robert View Post
    France? In this AAR? Oh my, you really do need some good chants... Magic even..
    Nah, for my own AAR of course. btw, I've come up with one now that makes your "rule the waves" sounds worthless.
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  7. #3487
    Lord of Slower-than-real-time El Pip's Avatar
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    Ahh the good old French insecurity complex. I must confess that even after many years of seeing it in action it still amuses me.

    So Ian will eventually return to the field, excellent. However that leads to another question; will he get a new partner? I do hope so, though I'm currently racking my brains to think who would be best.
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    Well, the Luftwaffe has been a bit mauled. Let's hope that neither it nor his Red allies are ready to face Market Garden.
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  9. #3489
    British Unionist trekaddict's Avatar
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    El Pip Well, for now Ian is part of the operations section of Fortitude. He will probably go back to being the NID fireman eventually, but not for now, most certainly not before Market Garden has kicked off.

    Kurt_Steiner Hrm. The British victory was more decisive than in OTL, but the enemy has more resources to direct against Britain to begin with.
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  10. #3490
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    I have decided to trash all my plans. I had good ideas for a plot-line with massive cloak and dagger sheming, commando raids and so on, but decided that these work even better when there are already British troops on the continent. After re-watching Band of Brothers, I am itching for some Para action, so with luck we shall invade Europe this time next week. I will try to make high-quality updates about fortitude and so on... From both sides of course. Does anyone mind?
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  11. #3491
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    Quote Originally Posted by trekaddict View Post
    I have decided to trash all my plans. I had good ideas for a plot-line with massive cloak and dagger sheming, commando raids and so on, but decided that these work even better when there are already British troops on the continent. After re-watching Band of Brothers, I am itching for some Para action, so with luck we shall invade Europe this time next week. I will try to make high-quality updates about fortitude and so on... From both sides of course. Does anyone mind?
    Am I the one who gave you the idea for Band of Brothers?
    And of course we mind- Err, DON'T mind! Hehehe >.>

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  12. #3492
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    Dear Trek.. You offer us an invasion of fascist Italy.. Paras, battle-updates, Ian Fleming in action on enemy territory... and you ask us, if we MIND!!!??!

    How can anyone even remotely sane possibly mind that!!??!!

    What you've just set in motion is a series of collective faints of sheer awesomeness among your readers around the globe...

    So, before we die from anticipation, please release us from the pain of waiting any longer.. please?

    .....................................
    When the Germans come
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    GREAT BRITAIN

    If they're marching on
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    GREAT BRITAIN

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  13. #3493
    British Unionist trekaddict's Avatar
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    Awe-some.
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  14. #3494
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    Chapter 167


    10th July 1941


    Berlin

    The Abwehr was busy cleaning up the 'aftermath' of the Air Campaign against England that had failed to force the British to their knees. During the early days the Führer had refused to listen to Canaris' projections and reports that had clearly suggested that the RAF was capable of withstanding any sort of campaign for an extended time period. When things had started to to go as planned Canaris had recommended stopping the campaign as long as Axis air losses were proportionally smaller than that of the British, and now that it was all over, finding out what the British were up to next suddenly had the highest priority. In a series of high-level meetings between Canaris, the OKW and the Soviet GSFG Straff in Heidelberg one had agreed that the British were planning some sort of amphibious operation. The two Problems that Canaris was facing now were: “When and where.” Canaris said to Oster as the two Officers were walking through the corridors of the Abwehr Headquarters at night. “Sir, the British have no chance of landing anywhere in Europe before mid-1942, even with their expanded Army. They need...” “Yes, they need everything that we don't have either and the lack of which doomed Sealion. They would come earlier if they could.” Canaris objected. “But Admiral, then you also believe that the OKW is wrong about the place where they will land?” “I am indeed. Pas de Calais, mainly because it's the closest?” Canaris stopped to light a Cigarette. “That's too simple, too obvious!” he called out. “Would you land in the most obvious place just because it's the closest?” Oster shook his head in response, and Canaris took a deep throaty drag from his Cigarette. “Neither would I. Radio intercepts or not, I don't buy it! And thanks to the valiant efforts of the Luftwaffe we didn't have any evidence to the contrary of what they said to the Führer.” The two had reached the Admiral's Office and were seated. “I don't believe anything the OKW has compiled. At least not much of it. They have a point. The weather is too bad already for any sort of cross-channel Invasion. No, Hans, if I were Gort and would attack cross-channel, then yes, this year is out. The weather simply does not allow it. Besides, they have to assemble more troops.” Canaris stumped out his smoke and poured them drinks from the bar he had in his Office. “Do you know what the idiots from the OKW said when I pointed out that the British have been shipping troops to North Africa ever since we defeated France?” “No, Admiral.” Oster said even though he knew. “They said that this was a diversion or for a secondary landing in Sicily.” Canaris sighed. “Of course it's no help that we can't really tell how many and what sort of troops they are moving there, but I can't believe they would waste some of their most elite formations on Sicily of all places!” Canaris handed Oster a piece of paper. Oster read it. It was a report by an Italian Agent near Tobruk and reported that units of the 7th Armoured Divison, the 'Desert Rats' had taken up camp there. “But Admiral, perhaps it is because they were already in the theatre, after all they were among the first units they moved there in 1940, and what about the French?” Oster asked. “They will of course press for a landing at the Pas de Calais, to be carried out two months ago. But whatever the Poison Dwarf says, the British won't let themselves be blackmailed. Not after Canada.”

    “Yes, that's perfectly right of course." "But it bugs me. And when something bugs me I follow up on it.” Oster nodded. “So what are we going to do?” “That's the problem. I have already assembled what information I could over the last three months, and the British seem to be building up everywhere. Overall, I think there is no danger of a landing this year. There is no way they can land enough forces in a short enough timespan to prevent us from throwing them into the sea again. No, Hans, for now we must decipher where they will land. That has priority.” “So, your orders, Admiral?” Canaris unfolded a large map of Western Europe and Northern Africa. “So far, radio intercepts have detected buildups of activity here, in southern England, here in Scotland and here and here in Northern Africa, near Algiers and near Tobruk and Northern Egypt. We can be sure that part of that his pure deception designed to throw us off the scent. I might not agree with the OKW, but they were right in one thing, we can't disregard any of them, and and if the British have half a brain among they know we can't. We have next to no reliable sources in England itself, and most of those we, or rather the Italians, have in Northern Africa were swept under when the British destroyed the Italians there. Hans, I want you to get every scrap of information we get from these areas. Have your people filter out nothing, only categorize it by sources and put our best analysts on the job. We have to find out what the British are up to before it is too late.” “Yes, Admiral.”


    London

    “Field Marshal.” said the Prime Minister when Gort entered the Office in the Cabinet Bunker. “Prime Minister.” nodded the Soldier. Both men knew what the briefing was about. Churchill and Gort had spent the better part of the last two months doing practically nothing else, and it showed. Their views of Market Garden could not be more different. The PM was, Winston being Winston, totally convinced of success, whilst Gort would have preferred to have another half year for preparations. Because of that he was more than surprised when Churchill spoke. “Do you think the benefits are worth the risk?” Gort straightened his back and looked at the Prime Minister. He could see that Churchill was very tired, and this explained why the PM was so unusually outspoken about his doubts about anything. It was a question that Gort had posed himself quite a few times since he had proposed the plan to the PM, and he it had taken him a long time to find a suitable answer. He also knew that what he said now would have to sustain the Prime Minister until after it was over and done with, so he worded his response carefully. “In the long run? Most definitely, Sir. Each day we spend sitting here is one more for the Germans and Soviets to pillage the continent, one more to strengthen their defences, and despite what the French say over Radio Algiers, one more where the morale of those under the heel worsens. It is very, very risky, it will be risky for a long time after the landings and we could potentially loose our entire force. Am I willing to take that risk? Damn right I am. We could easily sit where we are now and wait until the Germans and the Soviets grow weary of this alliance, but we have a higher duty to those that do not have a forty mile stretch of water between them and the enemy. We are the only country in Europe that has the means to resist the Axis forces, and by God I believe we should do so, no matter the outcome. It is better to die on your feet that live on you knees.”

    Churchill yawned for a second and then looked at the Field Marshal with inquisitive eyes. “You really believe that, do you?” “I do, Prime Minister.” Churchill smiled warily and said: “So do, so do I.” He shook his head and suddenly he was the hard-working Prime Minister again that the public got to see. “Can we do it even though the French refused to commit forces for an Invasion outside of France itself?” “Yes, Sir. Given that the Paras can do their job, we can. We might not be able to amphibiously land more than five divisions, but if the first phase goes anywhere near the plan and we can keep the Regia Marina from destroying our Transports then yes.” For the next hours the two men discussed the particulars. There was a lot to be done; shipping construction was spewing out landing craft, and by mid-October they should have enough for six Divisions. Troops were being drawn together from all over the Empire, and Gort had just ordered the transfer of 1st 'King's Own' Royal Gurkha Airborne Rifle Brigade to north Africa with the next convoy. The Fleet needed it's new Carrier Aircraft, and Supermarine was desperately looking for enough production capacity to fill the orders for both the Spit- and the Seafire. Somerville needed time to work up the Carrier Aircrews of Force H, the Carrier Battlegroup in the Mediterranean Sea, with the new Aircraft, Royal Ordnance was working double shifts to fulfill their own contract for the new small Arms and last but not least the factories needed time to produce the new Cromwell tank and the new gun and the tank needed to be shipped to the desert where the 2nd Royal Hussars where already converting to the new gun, them being the most elite and highly decorated unit of the 7th Armoured Divison which was in turn seen as the best British Division and known as the 'Desert Rats' since their drive on Tripoli.


    A27M Cruiser Tank VIII Cromwell ( 2nd Royal Hussars/7th Armoured Division ) during a tank landing exercise in Lybia, September 1941




    Meanwhile Ian and the rest of Operation Fortitude were having the time of their lives. Ian was revelling in the opportunity to meddle with the minds of his German and Soviet counterparts, and Fortitude gave him plenty opportunity to do so. The deception operations were far more extensive than it had been revealed to him. In southern England for example the Royal Logistics Corps were seemingly building Army Camps that were intentionally nowhere near completion but were easily visible from the air, there various deception of whose existence but not nature Ian was aware, which consisted of ULTRA, to gauge effectiveness and the Double Cross System[1] which used turned former German agents to feed false information to the enemy. This had begun even before the fall of France when it had been used to convince the Germans that the British air and ground defences were stronger than they actually had been at that point, later on during the Battle of Britain to downplay British losses. The system was expertly handled. The agents did not report any faked plans as such, that would have aroused too much suspicion, but rather unit patches, markings on Army vehicles, increased demand in certain Army related comodities on the civilian market, all to support the main effort of Fortitude, the wireless deception in which Ian was directly involved, essentially running the Navy parts of the same. Wireless stations all over southern England sent out fake reports of every imaginable sort, from deployments, readiness reports, manoeuvres that were either fake or carried out by Home Defence units that sometimes even carried fake insignia on their vehicles and that were always supported by strategically placed articles and items in the press, whilst real information, where available was slapped with a D-Notice if so desired. Ian was coming in late in the game, with Fortitude having been started as early as March 1940 when the deception efforts of Army, Navy and Air Force had come under the direct control of the Minister of Defence, in this case the Prime Minister. Ian's predecessor had in an air-raid, and there was little new to do for him, even though he started up a new unit that was to send messages from a 'newly established 42nd Support Flotilla' meant to give close gunfire support to landing troops. For him the days were good, since he could spend his off-time with his family and to the work he loved.


    [Notes: So yes... Up next is are visits to some old friends and then some gadgetry.]

    [1] Very much real. It was used in OTL to support the D-Day landings. The more I read about it, the more I am convinced that the British Spymasters of WW2 were experts in mindf**king the Abwehr.
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    Ahh yes, Mindf**king the Abwehr never gets old.

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    I really want to catch up with this but I havent read since Chapter 107(ish) and I dont have the time . Looking good though Trekaddict!
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    Inching ever closer to the invasion, I like the way everyone knows it's going to happen and Canaris is fully aware he's being played but just can't work out how. Excellent.
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    Quote Originally Posted by trekaddict View Post
    [1] Very much real. It was used in OTL to support the D-Day landings. The more I read about it, the more I am convinced that the British Spymasters of WW2 were experts in mindf**king the Abwehr.
    I'm sorry but I have to disagree here. There is no one better than the Abwehr itself to mindf**king itself.

    Praised be Canaris and Oster for their outstanding work. No pun intended.
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  19. #3499
    British Unionist trekaddict's Avatar
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    Griffin.Gen It never does. Hopefully the MAD ( Militärischer Abschirmdienst or Military Counterintelligence Agency ) today has more skill.

    Raaritsgozilla Then get cracking!


    El Pip Admittedly Canaris in this chapter is based on General Marcks ( 7th Army ) in "The Longest Day" who thought exactly the same. What I like about that movie is that the Germans are played by prominent German actors of the day. The lot of them. But yes, He knows he is being played, and in more ways than he thinks.

    Kurt_Steiner
    It's unclear just how much of that was the work of the Abwehr or not. Reportedly after the war Churchill was asked why the Allies never had Hitler killed, he said that Hitler was after 1943 the biggest asset for the Allied war effort.
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  20. #3500
    Pantomacatalasecesionanis ta

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    Quote Originally Posted by trekaddict View Post
    Kurt_Steiner It's unclear just how much of that was the work of the Abwehr or not. Reportedly after the war Churchill was asked why the Allies never had Hitler killed, he said that Hitler was after 1943 the biggest asset for the Allied war effort.
    If the Allies had only just listened to them in 1938... or if they had followed the idea of killing Hitler given by Noel Mason-Macfarlane during those same dates...
    "Pequeño Padawan Kurtizacoal, por qué me has salido tan cabrón?" - me dijo mi Maestro.
    Palo Dixit: posible Anticristo, vacalentacialanonanista, Culé y Salido que provoca manifas por donde pasa.
    Palo Dixit redux: Escatológico bipolar

    AARs en curso o acabados -Ongoing and finished HoI2 AARs-
    WritAAR of the Week:16-03-07/5-04-09/13-09-09/19-09-10/28-10-11 - Fan of the week 25-03-07/29-10-07/06-04-08/29-12-08/13-09-09 - Canonized 02-12-07 - Best Character WritAAR of the Week:03-04-09- Showcased 01-05-2010/10-12-2010 - Mi blog: Polvo de diamante (2) [Actualizado 20/11/2014]

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