Kara Koyunlu's dash for Greatness - an EU2 SG

[Sir El'WoN]

Im here Whats up guys I got the file now and start playing it right away...but first i will get familiar with the situation of the empire

[Brian Roastbeef]

Im here Whats up guys I got the file now and start playing it right away...but first i will get familiar with the situation of the empire

Good to know you're still in the game.


By the way, I don't think things will move that quickly, but just in case I want to mention right now that I probably won't be able to take my next turn until at least Sunday. After today, I probably won't even log onto this board until late Friday.

It might work out just right, now that El'WoN is back, but if you guys get through your turns quickly, don't hesitate to shift me back in the lineup for the next round.

[Olav]

Good to hear, Sir E!

Roger that, Brian. I think I'll start the next round on Friday, by the way.

[Brian Roastbeef]

Good to hear, Sir E!

Roger that, Brian. I think I'll start the next round on Friday, by the way.

Sounds good, Olav. In that case, I'll be able to go 3rd or 4th, if not in 2nd again depending on how quick you post your go, or when Lordling is available. Later.

[Sir El'WoN]

I must apologize to u that i have held the game that long and havent playd it :P I just dont really have time to play it right now thats why i must ask olav to remove me from the regulars list :P Id like to follow this whenever i have a free moment but i might not be able to play at that moment when its my turn Hope u will forgive me :P And im not a good player anyway.
I wish u best luck on ur Safavid Campaign.
Sir El'WoN

[Olav]

Sorry to hear that, Sir E. There will always be room for you if you want to play a turn again, though.

I'll start the new round later today then.

Roster - Round 5
Olav
Dell19
Lordling
Brian Roastbeef
Open
Open

Edit: I'll wait until tomorrow to start the new round.

[Olav]

Status 1539 - Round 5

Not much to say here - we got a really good military now. We have around 60 000 men right now; we could support 90 000. It doesn't seem that we need more at the moment, though.

Regarding the DP, I suggest going for Free Trade or Plutocracy. Cavalry is less important now, so higher cost for them won't matter much. I'm a bit more worried about the Diplomatic value we will lose. As we will fight wars in the years to come, it is good that the BB will cool down as fast as possible.

We don't get any settlers now, so we should start considering wether we go for Naval, Free Trade or Narrowminded in the near future. Narrowminded will give the biggest boost to settlers (+0.40) while the two others give less (+0.20).

We're pretty safe on our eastern borders now, with Khiva and Uzbek converted. Uzbek is allied to some Indian states (like Sindh, which is Shiite), that's the only bad thing. To the west we still got the OE hanging over us. However, I feel more secure now that we got firearms too. Crimea is currently in a war against Russia, while OE is idle. OE is allied with Crimea and Astrakhan. To our southwest we got the Mamluks, allied to Mogadishu, Dulkadir and Tunisia.

BB: 14.3/41
Inflation: 4.2%
Allies: Iraq and Khiva
Vassals: Imereti and Iraq
Techs: LT 10, NT 2, Trade 2, Infra 3
CB's: Loads

We're not far off LT level 11 or Trade level 3 - I suggest focusing getting these as soon as possible. Then we could go for Infra level 4. Regarding the other goals they're the same as usual.

I don't have time to play right now. Could you take it, Dell?

[Dell19]

I'm not that keen on playing back to back turns unless it is necessary.

[Olav]

Sure, I understand. I'll play my turn tomorrow.

Roster

Olav
Lordling
Brian
Dell
Open
Open

[Brian Roastbeef]

I won't be able to go today, like I previously thought, but it looks like that won't be a problem. Third in the lineup should work for me.

I would suggest not going naval. I'd still like to keep the manpower and morale bonuses that high Land gives. Plus we're high enough to have that Fire bonus, we might as well make use of it now that we're over LT 9. Of the three, I'd aim for Free Trade, I guess. More merchants to go with the settlers. Events should help us to get there, too.

I usually tend to go toward Free Subjects later in my games, since I'm usually rich enough to deal with the added stability cost. As far as Aristocracy/Plutocracy, I aim in favor of Aristocracy, for the Diplomatic bonus, particularly with BB still in double digits.

We should get Trade 3 if its only a year or two away. Other than that whether we aim for Infra 4 (and 5) or LT through 14, I guess depends on where the Ottomans are right now and who we may plan on fighting when. If we can get our Badboy to cool some, I'd like to cripple the Ottomans as soon as possible, since they've still yet to really expand in the Middle East. Or we can beat them to the punch by grabbing some of the Mameluk's northern territories before they can.

[Olav]

Conversion of African Tribes

1539

As mentioned, it was time to move the DP sliders. I moved one click towards Free Trade. We still lose 1.30 settlers per year though.

In June, the conversion in Sivas was completed successfully. We have 3 Sunni provinces left now: Kurdistan, Kara Kum and Lut, with the latter currently being converted. However the chance for success in the two former is so low, that I didn't send any missionaries there. We could "save" those provinces and hope for a random conversion event.

Earlier I talked a bit about getting military access in Kilwa, so we could easily send conquistadors to South Africa. Since Kilwa was Sunni (and relations not surprisingly at -200), it was too much to hope for getting MA diplomatically. War was inevitable:

Tahmasp I was waiting in Socotra (I didn't notice him when I wrote the status report ) with a decent force. His army was reinforced with some infantry and then sent to the Zanzibar Strait. Mombasa was allied to Kilwa, and they were the first target. The small fortress at their capital was assaulted and captured at first try. Galana had no fort, so warscore was quickly at 100%. Mombasa was forceconverted, and we got MA and 25 ducats in addition.

1540-42

Kilwa was a tougher nut to crack. Their mainland provinces were quickly captured. However while I was occupied there, they built a relatively big army on Zanzibar, reaching around 28 000 men. On the other hand, they didn't have firearms like Tahmasp's army, so they were annihilated after a long battle. When warscore reached 100%, they were, just like Mombasa, forceconverted. The main goal was of course MA, and we got that + 100 ducats. I could have taken Zanzibar from them in the peace deal, as it is a rich province. However the +2BB convinced me to let it be. I could also have vassalized Kilwa, but I thought forceconversion was better.

While the war was raging, we got a "Diplomatic Move" event. We got more friendly with OE. I don't know if we needed that.

In October 1542 we got LT level 11. I started a upgrade of the small fortress in Sivas. In the next month we got a "Assassination of Noble" event: -2 stability. I invested some on stability to get it up to +2, then I shifted to the Trade slider. Trade 3 will be reached in ~1556.

1544

The conversion in Lut failed. I started a new one.

1545-49

Nothing special happened these years. I had sent some merchants to our CoT in Azerbaijan, and when we got to the level below monopoly, I started sending merchants to Samarkand and the CoT in Kilwa. We should try to keep our position in these CoT as far as it is possible, so it will be easy to get a monopoly in them when we get Trade 3.

We got one event worth mentioning though, in 1558:

If we had remained it the city of Tabriz (in Azerbaijan), we would get -2 stability. Notice that the capital will be moved again, so don't build a FFA in Tabriz.

Paris is still in the hands of the English. It also seems that Austria is quite strong. That is good for us, as OE will get some tough wars in the Balkans.

BB: 13.7/41
Inflation: 4.2%
Vassals: Iraq and Imereti
Alliance: Iraq and Khiva
CB: Heaps of them

The save: http://www.savefile.com/files/1317057

---

I didn't do very much this turn, except for the war against Kilwa and Mombasa. At least we got access to uncharted territories down south. Lets hope we get a conquistador soon. If not we could get friendly with Zimbabwe (we could see their capital), and trade some maps with them.

Our Shiite neighbours are doing the right thing; Sindh, the Mughals and Ghara have started some conversions. Iraq, however, seems to lack the money to start at it again.

By the way Brian, it is the Quality slider, not the Land slider, that gives us + Fire value. But I agree that we should keep the +1 Fire for the rest of the game. In the war against Kilwa, we did have some naval engagements, and I must say, our navy performed rubbishly. We won all the battles though, but I was not impressed. We also met a single pirate warship, and we nearly lost the "battle", where we outnumbered them 40:1... So we should consider going naval, although we need many slider moves before we get naval morale bonus.

OE got LT level 13, I guess they'll soon reach level 14. So perhaps this is the time to DoW them? However, their Sultan is Süleyman, so they must have many (good) leaders. It is up to you, Lordling.

Roster - Round 5

1. Olav (Done)
2. Lordling (Up)
3. Brian
4. Dell
5. Open
6. Open

[Brian Roastbeef]

By the way Brian, it is the Quality slider, not the Land slider, that gives us + Fire value. But I agree that we should keep the +1 Fire for the rest of the game. In the war against Kilwa, we did have some naval engagements, and I must say, our navy performed rubbishly. We won all the battles though, but I was not impressed. We also met a single pirate warship, and we nearly lost the "battle", where we outnumbered them 40:1... So we should consider going naval, although we need many slider moves before we get naval morale bonus.

You know I did catch on to that afterward, but wasn't able to get back here until now to correct it... Maybe we should consider researching some Naval Tech, if we're still a Land CRT ahead of our neighbors, excluding Ottomans and Portugal. If we can get to NT 11 and build a Shipyard, we'll put a significant dent into that colonist defecit. Though I'm not certain about that myself, if the Ottos are hovering near LT 14 already... Do you know if we ever get a shipyard by event?

In my games, I still tend to prefer the +.5 Morale bonus and 25% extra manpower that comes with land, but if you think a couple of steps toward Naval is the easiest way to balance things, then I'll go along with it. We'll still have our Shiite morale bonus; I'll admit that isn't normally anything that's able to figure into my logic when I'm playing my other games...

If our stability isn't taking all that much to regain, then I wouldn't worry about the wrong culture conversions for now and hope that comes with an event. Or at least not spend money on Kurdistan/Armenia, which I think is expensive. We've built up a decent treasury again; maybe we might want to build another refinery?

[Olav]

Yeah, I figured that out. I don't know if we get a shipyard by event (I could skim through the event file), but researching NT soon sounds like a good idea. We're soon at NT level 4. But looking at our trends, it seems that LT, Trade and Infra got higher priority than NT.

If we're going Naval, we have to go "all" the way, that is, at least 5 slider moves before we get any naval morale bonus. So that is perhaps not desirable. However, with each move we will get more settlers and better trafe effeciency.

Stability is a bit expensive, but once we're investing into it, it regains quickly. So we could safely wait for a monarch with better ADM. On the other hand, the cost is actually not that bad (around 200-300 IIRC), so we could give it a shot now. I also support building a new refinery. We could also send some money to Iraq, and hope they'll start a new conversion. Iraq got only Turkish as state culture, by the way. So we got the same chance of success in converting the province as they have. However they probably got some money in their treasury now, so it's surely best to wait a little while longer before we annex them.

[YodaMaster]

I don't know if we get a shipyard by event

No shipyard by event for Safavids. You will have to build one.

[Lordling]

Got the file, played the game. CTD nine years in.

ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGHHH.

Had just taken Constantin-freakin'-ople. We also got a -3% bank inflation event, and two good years, leaving inflation handily at 0%. And then it crashed. So angry.

[Brian Roastbeef]

Got the file, played the game. CTD nine years in.

ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGHHH.

Had just taken Constantin-freakin'-ople. We also got a -3% bank inflation event, and two good years, leaving inflation handily at 0%. And then it crashed. So angry.

D'oh! Why do CTDs always happen at times like that? I wouldn't be surprised if there were also two conversions, an Unexpected Invention, five Gifts to the State, that Portuguese CoT defecting to us, and that event giving us a shipyard that Yodamaster just told us doesn't exist...

If you use a yearly autosave, I suppose that's okay if Olav thinks so, though it may not be fair for us to make that decision now that we know what happened. I mean would you do the same if there were four corruption events, a devastating fire, and getting our butts handed to us by the Ottomans? I always restart from the latest save myself if there's a CTD, whatever the circumstances.

I suppose its a moot point if you don't use autosave. Olav did have written in the rules that you get to do your turn again, if you didn't throw your computer through the wall, that is.

[Lordling]

Well, at least I won't be warring with the Ottomans this time around. They handily demolished us up until Austria decided to take all of their European possessions.

Then all of their Turkish possessions. Incidentally, the OE was left with one city in Europe, that being Constantinople, after a rather crippling Austrian peace. On the brighter side, that means when I play again, we won't possibly have to face an Austria that extends into Asia Minor.

[Brian Roastbeef]

Holy crap! Yeah, I actually might prefer the Ottomans there to Super-Austria. If we can knock away the eastern half of their empire and maybe force-convert them somewhere down the road, they could be a good buffer state to our west against Europe...

[Olav]

Damn! I know the feeling - those CTDs could sure be a pain in the ass. Of course, you should absolutely play your turn again. It's up to you wether you want to play from the start of your turn, or reload an autosave.

Generally, if CTDs happen, I'm all in for a reload of an autosave. So I strongly recommend having autosave on. Personally I autosave every third year, but it is perhaps wiser to save each year?

Thanks for the feedback, Yoda!

Edit: If you want to take your turn later on, Lordling, that should be very possible. I guess Brian won't mind taking his turn now.

[YodaMaster]

Thanks for the feedback, Yoda!

I keep an eye on this thead. Always interesting to see the mod in action and feedback of the players.

About the CTD, I even loaded the savefile but nothing strange with my test. Impossible to reproduce... It could be EU2 alone.