Deus Vult Improvement Pack - Discussion

jordarkelf said:

In a few hours I'll be on holiday without net access (yay!).
Anything will need to be picked up when I return.

Hope there aren't any serious issues in the current release...

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Have a nice holiday

Davisx3m said:

Have a nice holiday

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Gods yes! Have fun!

I have very little complaints about the mod, but I have a problem with the event that dumbs children down. I like the idea, but I feel it is far too harsh. My heir was brutally dumbed down as the event fired multiple times and by the time he inherited, he was a 0 in everything but stewardship, which he had a 1 in.

It also fired after he had finished his education to make it worse. As stated, I love the idea to provide a challenge, but as all my children are now terrible at everything I feel as if my dynasty is mentally handicapped, something I can't roleplay in my head at all.

Is there any way I can reduce the effects or even where this event is at?

If I may make an (uneducated) suggestion, I'd say the events should fire for one skill at a time. For example, if they have a 10+ in stewardship but a 4 to 6 rating in anything else, why should his lesser skills be affected? If possible I think it should only affect the skills in which he has a high rating.

Example: Edward de Conteville
Martial: 6
Diplomacy: 5
Intrigue: 14
Stewardship: 8

Now, Stewardship and intrigue could be nerfed, but since the other two aren't great they could be left alone. I'm sure everyone gets the point! At the very least I think the event should be less harsh.

LouisXI said:

I have very little complaints about the mod, but I have a problem with the event that dumbs children down. I like the idea, but I feel it is far too harsh. My heir was brutally dumbed down as the event fired multiple times and by the time he inherited, he was a 0 in everything but stewardship, which he had a 1 in.

It also fired after he had finished his education to make it worse. As stated, I love the idea to provide a challenge, but as all my children are now terrible at everything I feel as if my dynasty is mentally handicapped, something I can't roleplay in my head at all.

Is there any way I can reduce the effects or even where this event is at?

If I may make an (uneducated) suggestion, I'd say the events should fire for one skill at a time. For example, if they have a 10+ in stewardship but a 4 to 6 rating in anything else, why should his lesser skills be affected? If possible I think it should only affect the skills in which he has a high rating.

Example: Edward de Conteville
Martial: 6
Diplomacy: 5
Intrigue: 14
Stewardship: 8

Now, Stewardship and intrigue could be nerfed, but since the other two aren't great they could be left alone. I'm sure everyone gets the point! At the very least I think the event should be less harsh.

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I Agree in this post.

jordarkelf said:

typing from phone... i nerfed it a bit in the 4.9 update. if the problem is with that version as well, disable wiz.txt in events.txt to stop the event - it is the last one in the file. i will redo it when i get back.

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yeah, i really hated that event too. aslo wtih the newest one, my game keeps crashing in 1216. I'm not sure whats causing it, I go to war with the King of Thessalonia while playing as King of Nicea(can't spell i know). could the Goldern Horde which appaered in 1212 be causing it?

also in 1216 where i got to, a month beforea redundant crash ( july 13, same error and saved the game at June 28). Just keeps crashing. Posted the error that was reoccuring every time in technical support area.

also for 1204 scenario from addon. everytime i go to bride finder, it CTD's

LouisXI said:

I have very little complaints about the mod, but I have a problem with the event that dumbs children down. I like the idea, but I feel it is far too harsh. My heir was brutally dumbed down as the event fired multiple times and by the time he inherited, he was a 0 in everything but stewardship, which he had a 1 in.

It also fired after he had finished his education to make it worse. As stated, I love the idea to provide a challenge, but as all my children are now terrible at everything I feel as if my dynasty is mentally handicapped, something I can't roleplay in my head at all.

Is there any way I can reduce the effects or even where this event is at?

If I may make an (uneducated) suggestion, I'd say the events should fire for one skill at a time. For example, if they have a 10+ in stewardship but a 4 to 6 rating in anything else, why should his lesser skills be affected? If possible I think it should only affect the skills in which he has a high rating.

Example: Edward de Conteville
Martial: 6
Diplomacy: 5
Intrigue: 14
Stewardship: 8

Now, Stewardship and intrigue could be nerfed, but since the other two aren't great they could be left alone. I'm sure everyone gets the point! At the very least I think the event should be less harsh.

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I also have to agree alas. Your suggestion is a good one. The event fires several times for each individual usually. I also find that it fires when the stats are at 9 (rather than 10+), so I do not know if it checks unmodified stats rather than modified stats. At any rate it fires too often. I agree with the principle (to nerf the high scores in DV) but it seems heavy-handed.

edit: As an example: you can have a character with the stats:

Martial: 6
Diplomacy: 5
Intrigue: 14
Stewardship: 8

(as given above). An event will fire as the Intrigue is over 10. The event could reduce Int by up to 4 (leaving an Int of 10). If the other scores are reduced by half this (only 2 in this case, remember each can be reduced by up to 5!) that leaves:

Martial: 4
Diplomacy: 3
Intrigue: 10
Stewardship: 6

Now as it is hugely likely the event will fire again, and lets keep the relatively low scores of -4 for Int and -2 for the rest, that gives us:

Martial: 2
Diplomacy: 1
Intrigue: 6
Stewardship: 6

But as has been mentioned (and as I am finding) the scores generally reduce down to 5-7 for the main stat that caused the events to fire and 0-1 for the other (lower) stats.

Which is a little harsh.

Ayeshteni

Has there been much multiplayer testing of DVIP? We are using the mod (9.7) and crashing quite often. I've never played MP, so have no reference on amount of crashes.

Problems with new events

I'm playing the latest version of DVIP, and I've noticed some problems, probably bugs, and they're really starting to get on my nerves:

The education events that automatically fire aren't working very well, the monastic education one for girls fires as "UNKNOWN STRING WANTED", and while the initial ones work fine otherwise, the education switching events fire way too often, and there are kids who finish their education at 15 (All of them actually), but who then start a NEW education (Which is annoying as hell, since I lost a Brilliant Strategist because of this ). I'm guessing that finishing their education at 15 is the problem, and you should probably make the events not fire for people under 16.

Another thing: I don't think the event that lowers stats should fire for prodigies, but that's just a suggestion. The event does seem to fire too often though, and for characters who don't need it sometimes (I ended up with a 0.0.5.5 character, and he was my king's brother, who's a kid at the start of the game).

sanmartin said:

I'm playing the latest version of DVIP, and I've noticed some problems, probably bugs, and they're really starting to get on my nerves:

The education events that automatically fire aren't working very well, the monastic education one for girls fires as "UNKNOWN STRING WANTED", and while the initial ones work fine otherwise, the education switching events fire way too often, and there are kids who finish their education at 15 (All of them actually), but who then start a NEW education (Which is annoying as hell, since I lost a Brilliant Strategist because of this ). I'm guessing that finishing their education at 15 is the problem, and you should probably make the events not fire for people under 16.

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Thanks...this sounds like stuff from my events. I haven't had much feedback on them. I'll fix the education bug for 15-year-olds with finished education events. At least I think it is...if you could tell me the exact name or get a screenshot when it fires.

As for the unknown string error, I don't know what's happening their, though I can check...

As for timing issues, i can raise the MTTH on them.

I have an Mac version of Crusader Kings and DV. Do you know if the mod works on a Mac?

Edit:
OK, I gave it a try on the Mac, the game loads and seems to work, but after a couple of turns it CTD's.

Jinnai said:

Thanks...this sounds like stuff from my events. I haven't had much feedback on them. I'll fix the education bug for 15-year-olds with finished education events. At least I think it is...if you could tell me the exact name or get a screenshot when it fires.

As for the unknown string error, I don't know what's happening their, though I can check...

As for timing issues, i can raise the MTTH on them.

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Ah yes, my apologies for saying it was the Phoenix's.

Yes, the events need to have their MTTH's extended as they do fire too often (in fact the majority of events that fire are the education switching events and the lets-screw-over-talented-kids events. While I agree with it on principle, I think the 'prodigy' trait should have an impact (conditional or vast increase in MTTH).

I have noted that some kids get an education event when they are 15 (and already have one).

Nice events though.

Ayeshteni

Just a small note on the event that gives you a diocese bishop sent by the Pope/Patriarch. The question is - if you are a catholic vassal of an orthodox ruler (or vice versa) should the Pope or the Patriarch send you bishop?

Because right now the game only cares what your ruler religion is and if catholic - sends you catholic. But it does not take into consideration your liege.

EDIT:

Is the order of santiago supposed to pop up as Kingdom of Order of Santiago? Because that is what happened to me just now.

Ayeshteni said:

Yes, the events need to have their MTTH's extended as they do fire too often (in fact the majority of events that fire are the education switching events and the lets-screw-over-talented-kids events. While I agree with it on principle, I think the 'prodigy' trait should have an impact (conditional or vast increase in MTTH).

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Alright. How often do you see them firing for 1 kid before he finishes his education. My itention is for ~1/2 kids to get this normally. I specifically did not bar anyone from firing against because I wanted the oddball kid to appear who doesn't know what he wants.

Unfortunately I cannot check if an event has previously fired either.

If you have any further suggestions about how best to tweak mtth please let me know, although you should post any further comments on this in the appropriate discussion thread and not clog this thread up.

I have a few more event ideas left to do for that as well as well as add some more elaborate and better modifiers.

Ayeshteni said:

I have noted that some kids get an education event when they are 15 (and already have one).

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Those born normally in-game will not. Those created via the engine's spawning random courtiers both throught events that add a random courtier and through the engine repopulating an empty court (such as when you assign a new count his domain) will occasionally create a 15-year-olds and they have a finished education of some sort. If it does, it will also spawn another adult courtier. I do not know why this was left intact as the game already overpopulates enough, but it's been like that since 1.00.

In addition in vanilla CK some children start with finished education (this was removed in DVIP fairly early on).

For the love of god let's make Egypt's demense be the duchy of Jerusalem, while the alexandria and cairo lands can use the muslim JERU tag as the muslim duchy of Cairo? or something..

So when a crusade is called the christians will take Egypt's demense (Jerusalem lands) and form a real KoJ for the first time ever!

I'm really disapointed at how in DV loyalty, diplomacy and wars were not even touched, maybe i had forgotten how bad it in CK.

Oh well..to the point of this mod...

One thing i noticed is that by spreading rivals around in proper places, though it might look like a good thing and historically correct, got to remember these features don't really work well. Mainly what you are doing is garanting that said vassal will revolt in X amount of months because all it does is reduce the loyalty level and the loyalty level only makes it revolt. It doesn't affect it diplomatically it is just a revolt measure. So what ends up happening is that when you start the scenarion, hastings for example, germany implodes because of all the rivals that the king has. Spain implodes and gets devoured because all the catholic kings are now rivals. Granted spain disapears in 1 year without the rival thing...so it isn't that much of a change.

My suggestion would be to remove all the rivalry "features". Mainly this game isn't capable of handling a complex diplomatic relation. It only has 1 measure to follow and it is mostly based on traits. It doesn't even cosider interests or has any strategic view attached.

Another thing i would suggest is raising the requirements for claims, reducing or even removing the random claim events. Seriously you start a game and in 1 year you'll get 2 or 3 claims around your area just from people insulting you.

The last time i had played CK, before paying 19$ for this bride ledger you could actually play a game that more or less looked like normal where kingdoms would at least try to exist for more then a decade, but now it is impossible.

Hello. Thanks for the great mod!

I think I found a minor bug with the "Aid to Templars" event.

The answers B and C seem to be swapped. In the text file, the answer B is "No!" and the answer C is "Can spare gold". But in the .scv file it's the other way around. Thus when I got this event in game, the answers were a little messed up. Clicking "I cannot help" would give the knights a plenty of gold

Is it possible for a map of what areas are in what kingdom to be provided? I'm trying to figure out how this meshes with my own personal kingdom mods and thus what I have to do to get them to play nice together.