• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Leviathan07 said:
Hey there...
I am currently on page 38 of 45 and the story kicks ass :D

just one thing I'm wondering about, did you help the game along to create a strong western empire, Seljuk empire and a Franco-English empire? Or was that the game itself?

The strong Western Roman Empire came about from the Arpads inheriting from the von Frankens somehow. The Seljuks have gone through cycles of revolt with their vassals; a lot of the places they're shown as holding are off-map.

That a male Capet and a female de Normandie, or a male Arpad and a female von Franken, would marry isn't exactly odd in IRL terms, although I suppose it is odd in that the AI usually marries extremely important children off willy-nilly.
 
Everyone plots, and their plots seem so ingenious, and then along comes Manuel Komnenos, and it's as if they're children. His brother, his son - he just doesn't seem to be outdone, no matter what.
 
General_BT said:
Basil had been shy, Basil had been unsure, but Sophie was fairly sure she'd concieved their wedding night. Or perhaps it was the night after. Or the night after that. Basil had taken a liking to such activity, an liking she fully endorsed.

:rofl:



great update,
:) asd
 
Lordling said:
Everyone plots, and their plots seem so ingenious, and then along comes Manuel Komnenos, and it's as if they're children. His brother, his son - he just doesn't seem to be outdone, no matter what.
Let's hope he doesn't turn on his unexpecting son. :eek:

Even if Basil's a smart boy, he has his limits. One of those limits is probably to implicitly trust his "weakened" father, who as long as he was trapped on the bed would need the loyalty and service of his son, but not if he comes back fully healed...

One thing for sure though, Zeno is in for a surprise. :D

Oh, and I'm liking Sophie more and more. She's good at intrigue and -- so far -- appears to truly love and care for Basil. I hope there's nothing going on between her and our Jimenez anymore than being fellow supporters of Basileios, though. Rodrigo would be such a great spymaster and confidant as long as he remains loyal to his Greek friend.
 
Next full update is going to be delayed until later this week at the earliest.. end of semester stuff piling up, per usual this time of year. To sate you all, I have a short teaser after these replies:

Enewald - Rhys-Meyers is the old pic I've used for Manuel since day one. I thought it looked sufficiently evil to qualify for him. Yes, if he and Basil ever joined forces, they'd be a formidable pair - that's if Manuel would join with him. His one weakness has been his ability to make enemies, even with a genius for plotting and deviousness. And no, Manuel doesn't have any bastards... all of his kids are legitimate (for once).

And why is Sophie worse than Basiliea? She's concerned about her husband - she hasn't moved against Manuel (yet, at least), she's worried that this normally bloodthirsty guy might possibly (with arguably some good dynastic reason) come after her husband...

English Patriot - Yes, Basil is following the Komnenid family tradition of having kids early. But will he follow the other tradition of having a small army of children?

AlexanderPrimus - Oh, if this was about, say, the County of Vexin, I doubt it would be as Byzantine. Not enough courtiers or nobles to play with. :p Manuel is definitely up to something, something very dark and likely bloodthirsty, given his past track record. Its mostly a question of a) who are his targets, and b) how well has his ruse worked...

canonized - I brought in Rodrigo just for you. XD He's got an intrigue rating higher than the Emperor's (14, IIRC), and while he's cruel and devious, he's one of Basil's best friends, so it'd be natural for Sophie to try to turn there in a case like this.

RGB - Exactly! Did you think he was going to take Zeno muddling things up lying down? (pardon the pun) :) And yes, those that don't have some exceptional skills at survival at the least tend to not make it into the story - either because a) they're uninteresting, or b) they're dead.

VladAntlerkov - Welcome to the story! I'm glad you enjoy it! Some clarifications on the dynastic stuff - the Arpads didn't inherit the von Frankens, they DWed when the von Frankens were mired in a civil war and stole them, then used their Hungarian forces to gobble up the other princes in Germany that wouldn't join them one by one. As for the Capets and the House of Normandy, I needed some reason why the Pope would receive cash from France to finance a Roman revolt - it seemed the most logical thing I could come up with at the time (truth be told, other than snapping a screenie of Drogo the Mad, I kept little track of what was going on in France and Britain at this point in the game).

Leviathan07 - Welcome to the story! To further continue what I said above, the Seljuks were really screwed by their AI. 1074 (back when I was playing the Principality of Kappadokia), they had a chance to seize all of Anatolia - the Imperial armies were destroyed, mine were busy seizing Aleppo and Edessa (at the time I was planning assuming the Byzantine's fell, I could take the mantle "King of Syria" and rebuild the Empire that way). THe Seljuks made peace for 374 gold. The next time they tried, I was at the helm, not the crappy Byzantine AI, and they got fought to a standstill. The rest, as they say, is history.

Alot of the lands I've shown them holding are lands that are off-map in CK... lands that historically they probably would've held. I really wish CK's map went further east into Central Asia, as many events there directly cascaded into the Holy Land. Since if one looked at their on-CK holdings it wouldn't make much sense for the Seljuks to try to take on even a weakened Manueline Byzantine Empire, I made a map pretending they had lands further east, justifying their strength.

Estonianzulu - Glad you liked it!

Lordling - Thats perhaps Manuel's greatest tragedy. If Manuel, with his skill, was more of a statesman like Nikolaios, he could have been a formidable and extremely successful Emperor along the lines of Justinian or Augustus. Instead he has all the deviousness in the world, and too much self-confidence, but not the ability to garner the love of his people - only the army.

asd21593 - See, Basil's not a complete prude. :rofl:

Irenicus - Basil has the same intrigue rating as his father, but considering his traits, I'm playing him as someone who can recognize plots, make some ingenious ones of his own, but only does it within certain moral rules. Backstabbing his father (or expecting his father to backstab him) would be one of those things that would be outside his moral boundaries, so it would be beyond consideration. As for Sophie - I'm kind of playing her as a "what if" Anastasia Komnenos, from all the way in the beginning, hadn't died in childbirth...

As for Rodrigo, he's devious, he's a cad, but is he loyal? We shall see...

==========*==========

romearisen2.png

October 9th, 1163 - 8 AM

Murad Arslan pulled hard on the reins of his horse, trying to calm the beast down. The stallion had been a gift from the city fathers of Palmyra, in thanks for Murad not sacking the city after its surrender. The beast was wild and spirited - and the Arslan prince wondered if it had been a Roman plot of some kind to kill him with kindness. Nonetheless, the noble and powerful looks of the creature persuaded the Turkish prince to ride him everywhere - it let him tower over his other riders, most of whom rode more docile, even skittish mares.

Murad and his people had always used mares in battle - Mares were faster, and tended to flee when provoked, something a lightly armored archer on hroseback would be inclined to do anyways if heavy enemy troops closed. It wasn't until recently for the ghulams that Murad's father began copying the Europeans and using stallions in battle - they were larger, braver, and inclined to charge come hell or high water - the perfect strong horse for heavy cavalry.

Today, Murad had nearly four thousand of the new ghulams with him, to compliment the eight thousand horse archers and eighteen thousand infantry he had managed to cull from the sieges all across Syria. It was a mighty host, yet something about all of this mess galled him.

"Highness, there they are," one of his lieutenants pointed. Murad held his hand over his eyes and squinted. Sure enough, in the surf, was a vast sea of men, marching slowly. Beyond them, he could make out the masts and sails of the Roman fleet, following them.

Murad frowned. He'd been gleeful only a month before. Damascus had finally fallen, and it'd seemed that slowly, bit by bit, the eighteen month siege of Antioch was slowly reaching its end. His men had stormed several of the outer bastions, and one enterprising commander even managed to poison one of the great wells that supplied the city with fresh water. Its defenders were slowly dying or deserting, and there was no prospect of reinforcement. Everything seemed to be in Murad's grasp - if Antioch fell, only the minor cities of SYria would be left - and Murad would be free to assign his main field force to help either his father in Anatolia or Murad Bey in the Levant.

wallsantioch.jpg

By October of 1163, the formerly impregnable defenses of Antioch seemed about ready to fall to the merciless Turkish attacks...

Yet the arrival of all those Romans and Franks changed that.

Murad recieved word of their landing near Alexandretta only two weeks before. and at first he was incredulous. The numbers seemed too small! No Roman would be stupid enough to land in the heart of Syria with only thirteen thousand troops!

Yet there they were, in all their impudent glory, marching slowly to Antioch, no doubt with relief supplies as well as enough troops to double the garrison of that wretched city.

"They march in a strange formation, Highness. It is like a box, with their infantry on the outside, then their archers, then their cavalry, then closest to the sea, their baggage."

Murad nodded. The scouts had told him that three days before. The formation moved slow as a snail, and even Murad could see that as long as they held formation, it was nigh impenetrable. Yet, he reasoned, if they could get that formation to crack, the Romans would have no where to run - they had the sea at their backs, they were vastly outnumbered.

"Orhan! Mehmet!" Murad barked, and promptly the commanders of his horse archers and ghulams trotted up beside him.

"Orhan, can your arrows crack that hedge?" Murad pointed.

Orhan settled into his saddle, eyes twice as old as Murad looking at the ungainly enemy formation. "Do they have Franks?"

"Yes," Murad said, "Frankish cavalry."

"The Romans won't budge, Highness, they are far too disciplined in my experience," Orhan said after a moment, "but the Franks, from what I hear, are reckless and foolish, motivated by vanity and not military prudence. If your scouts can tell me where the Franks are in that formation, I'll tell my men to concentrate there. If we can get the Franks to want to charge out, we might rip their formation wide open."

Murad nodded. "Mehmet, if Orhan can get their ranks to crack, it will be up to you and the ghulams. I'm not going to send the infantry into a needless bloodbath - the Romans are far better armored and equipped. I need those men for sieges, not battles."

"Yes, Highness," Mehmet bowed his head. "And if the Romans don't crack?"

"Smack them anyways with the ghulams," Murad growled. "Maybe you can get them to break. They broke at Tell Bashir, when they were clearly better led."

"But Highness," Mehmet bowed, "galloping headlong into rows of spears is a waste of my ghulams!" the Turk complained.

"So if my horsemen do not convince them to budge, you would let them march on to Antioch?!" Orhan complained as the trio turned their horses around and cantered back to the army waiting behind the hills.

"And letting them march to Antioch is any better?" Murad added. Eighteen months of hard work had been invested in that siege, countless lives had been lost. Murad wasn't about to let a paltry force of Romans destroy all of that work. That formation would break, the Franks would be the key.

"Majesty, we could lay siege to Antioch again. You have other sieges that will soon end, and fresh infantry to besiege those walls once more," Mehmet pleaded, "but we have a limited number of ghulams. Having them charge headlong into such a formation would waste them, killing many! Wasting them would destroy the fighting power of your army for the rest of the conflict! Your father needed ghulams at Tell Bashir. What would happen if you lost your ghulams here, on some nameless beach, instead of saving them for a real battle?"

Murad looked at his lieutenant, and finally nodded after more grumbling. It was galling. The Romans were supposed to come out in their standard formations, ready to fight their old way - that's the way Murad and his men had practiced for - not march slowly down the beach like some immense hedgehog. The Turkish Prince was in a classic bind - he couldn't let the Romans reach Antioch, but he couldn't needlessly waste his army fighting them here.

That's not how it was supposed to be. But Mehmet was right - Murad could lay siege to Antioch again, and other sieges would soon draw to a close. The Turks could always draw the Romans into the interior, where forming such a bristling formation would be more difficult without the sea on one's flank.

Only if the Romans marched into the interior, it wouldn't be with thirteen thousand, it'd also include every single man they could spare, a force that might equal Murad's in size. Murad sighed.

"We harass them today," the Turkish prince said finally. "God willing, we break their formation. If not, we harass them tomorrow, and the day after, and the day after. Perhaps, if we can't break their lines, we can whittle them down."

Murad hoped that was the case. If not, he could be facing a much larger Roman army in the field in only a few months time.

==========*==========
arsuf.gif

The Turkish horse archers gallop forth to face the Romans...


Basil has finally landed, and Murad is plotting his next move. How will it all turn out? Will the Turks strike hard enough at the Achille's heel of the allied army, the Latin discipline, to get it to break formation? Will the Scots, Danes and Welsh hold ranks in the face of a Turkish hornet's nest? The 'Battle on the Beach' is next on Rome AARisen!
 
Last edited:
Hmm the over-valourous latins could be a large problem, especially in terms of their leaders, we can only hope Basil can keep them under control and hold formation, I think alot will rest on Basil's ability to lead him men..
 
I smell blood. Hopefulyl turkish blood. :p
Not latin. :)

The latins won't survive... but neither will the turks attacking that formation.
Murad only needs to encirlce the whole army, like Caesar did to Pompeius in Greece. ;)
 
Kind of reminds me of that one king's march towards Jerusalem . Forgot who XD
 
Regarding the Seljuks' off-map holdings, I always thought of those as being represented by the extremely-wealthy provinces in Central Asia, east of the Caspian.

And since Basil's traits got brought up, I'm guessing his Merciful trait is probably going to show through against Murad. Assuming he wins, of course, but given that this is a story about Byzantium and the Komnenoi and that he is basically George Washington complete with the two sets of testicles (so divine) and the kills-with-stares bit, he'll probably win.
 
Aha, so Antioch is why Murad needs to tackle this box thing.

Do Basil's crossbowmen have to march backwards for days as well?
 
Certainty: Murad will not be the next Sultan.
 
If the Seljuk generals know to pinpoint the weakness of the box formation at the Latins, seemingly without even much thinking, I am quite certain that the Roman Kwisazt Haderach is not only perfectly aware of it, but already has plans in which he'll exploit that very issue to his advantage.

It's going to be a truly epic debut for the military career of a new War God!

General_BT said:
As for Sophie - I'm kind of playing her as a "what if" Anastasia Komnenos, from all the way in the beginning, hadn't died in childbirth...
Indeed. I do remember how I thought it was really sad when Demetrios' true love and consort died in childbirth, and how the following events really laid down the framework for the tragedies that would follow, from Hajnal's hatred, the fall of Nik's half-brother, the struggles of Nikolaios Komnenos in exile, etc.

Sophie's appearance in this manner is like a chance for redemption from its trend of disloyal empresses; especially since those that aren't all that disloyal or promiscuous (i.e. Manuel's latest wife) appear to be politically inactive at best.

In other words, to use an internet dialect, you are so win for making her like that. :)
 
whew! finally caught up with the story. amazingly well portrayed characters. I liked the way Manuel was revealed to be not quite as incapacitated as everyone thought. :D

my 2c on Sophia: She thinks too much. Was obvious when she spent what seemed like two screens of text just thinking about all the might-be-could-be tangentials as Manuel stirred his legs.

Also she and Basil are not that much alike, and both are too "perfect", they don't really need each other on an emotional basis once fresh love has worn off. Basil will find that he can get the same kick out of other women as well (once his awkwardness has worn off) and Sophia will find out that he's not THAT special once she's around him more often. They're both also too focused on themselves. Eventually they'll drift apart and plot against each other, just as all Byzantine couples do eventually. :eek:o
 
Hey! New reader here, and this whole thing is amazing!

I'm still working my way through the first chapters...but I have to know something right now:

Where the heck did you get all these awesome maps? :D

Thanks!
 
Murad has some smart assistants. Forcing the Romans inland was the best decision. If somehow he can break the Roman's supply and starve them out, they will be forced to break their formation and be eaten alive.
 
Comments on the last two updates:

It's a pity they didn't have indoor plumbing back then; poor Sophie's flesh must have been crawling after that encounter with Manuel. I know I would have needed several showers to feel clean again. It's ironic that I'm writing this while watching the most recent episode of The Tudors; I get to despise Rhys-Myers as Henry VIII there (not to mention that Shatnerian monologue, lol!) and as Manuel here simultaneously. Cool.

Still, faking paralysis is always fun. [Obscure reference] "Sooner than you think" always gives me chills. [/OR]

So Murad is still sieging Antioch? Well that does change things…did it really take the AI over 18 months to reduce it? Wow. I think Murad has hit upon the right plan, though; simply harry and reduce. They have the longer supply lines, and you have the numbers. But they have the general with the 24 martial, so…

re VladAntlerkov (and welcome!):
The strong Western Roman Empire came about from the Arpads inheriting from the von Frankens somehow.
This is actually just random chance acting on the historical scenario, rather than bizarre AI manipulations; at the start of the 1066 scenario, Heinrich von Franken's only surviving sibling, his sister Jutta, is married to King Salomon Arpad of Hungary. If Salomon and Jutta produce a son, and Heinrich does not, that Arpad nephew becomes the heir to Heinrich's crowns. I gather that's what happened here (although perhaps a generation or two down the line…).
 
kalenderee said:
...I thought Salamon was hardcoded never to breed.

Leastways, I've never, EVER seen him produce a kid.

Checking the 1066 files, yep, Salamon has zero fertility. Then again, it's not like +fertility traits are hard to get, and he has a long time to get them.
 
I want to do some quick replies while I have a break from work (well, before I crash)... I'm currently running on caffeine (no sleep since Sunday afternoon, its currently Tuesday afternoon) thanks to some chaotic schoolwork. So I'm a tad loopy, please excuse that in my replies. :)

Oh, and as a final reminder... ACA voting ends tomorrow. So if you have not done so please go vote for your favorite AARs. Time is short, but I would urge everyone to take a look around, and try to add new AARs to your ballot as well as old favorites. You cannot believe how much of a boost it is to writers who have never been nominated before (or those that have been nominated, but not won) to receive such a vote of confidence!


VladAntlerkov - Hmmm... well, I know for sure Demetrios married a Hajnal Arpad the game said was one of several children of Salamon. I don't remember his traits though... now I'm curious. I'm going to look them up in a bit. As for the Seljuk holdings - yes, that's how CK portrays them, but the grad student in me wanted to be a dork and expand the map. :rofl:

kalendaree - See above. It's got me confused too. I'm betting he got slapped with indulgent and lustful or something...

It's Amazing - That is exactly why I picked Rhys-Meyers for the pictures of Manuel - he just has that sneer that looks slightly deranged and wholly unsettling.

As for the Seljuk War - in game it went quite a bit differently than I'm telling it in the AAR. I think the AAR's version is a lot better and more interesting. At some future milestone as an extra I might add a bit titled "Confessions" or whatnot (complete with cheesy soap-opera-esque graphics) where I'll reveal what happened in game with this and several other events...

Estonianzulu - Do you think someone as smart as Sulieman is going to leave his boy alone, with such a great responsibility, without having some old hands stay behind to provide some guidance? Sulieman trusts his son, but that doesn't mean having some old friends stay behind to make sure the boy does things "the right way" doesn't hurt.

Actinguy -Welcome to the AAR! The maps are mostly photoshopped versions of the blank CK maps available on the forums (I don't have the link on me right now). There's also a blank map available for EU3 Europe as well. Next update I'll have the link hunted down and post it for you!

Leviathan07 - The longer the story gets, the more I think medals might be in order for those who manage to catch up. :) As for Sophie - hmmm, you might have hit on her one major weakness, at least when it comes to Manuel. She knows him as a devious plotter, and so there's the chance she's seeing plots where there actually aren't any. As for Sophie and Basil - you would think that. We'll have to see if the two of them follow the path that's been well beaten by the likes of Hajnal and Basiliea...

Irenicus -Hahahaha! See, now there's the fun in waiting between updates - if the Seljuks see the weakness, doesn't Basil know it? And if Basil's following the Megos' mantra of showing a weakness to give yourself a known (and thus a strength)...

...or Basil could be a 16 year old Kwitzach Haderach and not recognize the weakness through inexperience. :)

Fulcrumvale - Murad is only 20... there's plenty of time left for him to learn some of the wisdom of his father. That is, assuming Sulieman lives a long and fulfilling decade or more...

AlexanderPrimus -Well there you have it, our first bets on how this story arc ends up! Do we have anyone that wishes to see this bet, or raise it? :D

RGB - If Basil wants to keep them in that formation for days on end, yes, they would be marching backwards if an enemy was behind them. Its part of the reason the formation is so slow and ungainly, and why some of Murad's assistants want to drag it inland where its slow speed and reaction time can play directly into the traditional Turkish advantages of speed and manueverability.

canonized -Yeah, you know, that one guy. Kinda unknown - Richard somebody? I heard he was a real loser, that one. Nobody would remember an idiot like him. ;)

Enewald - Perhaps. That would certainly be Caesar's move against a force like this. Though Pompey didn't have longbows and crossbows to peck away at Caesar's forces. Whether thats enough to change the equation... who knows?

English Patriot - All I will say about the overzealous Latins is two things:

- There is a reason the Knights of St. John will be renowned for their discipline.

- John Dunkeld is a moron.