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Thread: Rome AARisen - a Byzantine AAR

  1. #5461
    “Sistak was the day I-ran was born.” - Nur al-Din Ni’mat Allah, Persian poet and philosopher, 1368
    I'm calling it right now; Alexandros is destined for greatness.

  2. #5462
    Imperator General Ksim3000's Avatar

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    Well just to let you know BT, I'm still here and enjoying Rome AARisen with each and every new installment! I was even reading this AAR when I was in Cape Town over the recent Christmas holidays visiting family that live out there!

    I can't really say anything except from "WOW" and how long its been since I've been reading this AAR. Infact its not really an AAR now but a "masterpiece" that could put JK Rowlings "Harry Potter" to shame....

    Anyway, the only request I've got on this end is for an update to your banner! I mean we've got new characters entering the story now and many of them on it have already passed on....such as Gabriel, Cecilia, Doryotta, etc...

    I think that picture in your last update of Gabriel would suffice quite nicely...

    Keep well my friend and I'll always been reading whether I go.

  3. #5463
    Quote Originally Posted by Panjer View Post
    I'm calling it right now; Alexandros is destined for greatness.
    That, or Nikephoros is destined for failure

  4. #5464
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    Actually, is Gabriel still alive, mooching about that old palace? He must be nearing his seventies at least.

  5. #5465
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyingDutchie View Post
    Well, the Western threat lasted less long than I'd expect, with the German armies disintegrating after the first real fight and France wighting to save Paris. Still, the succes of the Gendarme could mean problematic in the future, as their semi-feudal nature means it could be easily copied in Germany, Poland and other potential future threats.
    Not quite... the Gendarmes are landless knights, they're paid a wage by the king (more or less). A king can only afford this if he has reliable income, either from the royal desmesne or from large and RELIABLE sources of taxation within his empire. I don't think Germany is at the point yet where the (German) Emperor can afford to fund a standing army.

  6. #5466
    Seeing as Germany is the most decentralized of all the great European powers, especially after their most recent defeat at the hands of Alex, I don't think the Arpads will be able to afford any kind of formidable army for a long while

  7. #5467
    Field Marshal Tommy4ever's Avatar
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    I had no idea what Nikopheros' illness was. Looking at the comments below its apparently pretty obviously leporacy. That can't be good.

    The military campaigns seem to have gone just as I suspected. The Latins imply have nothing with which to compete. However I expect the looting of the wealth of the HRE by the Dynatoi is going to be a cruicial part of the future collapse of the Empire. Within assurances that the collapse will begin before 1300 I think its clear that that wealth is going to be used by the Dynatoi to payroll whatever envolvement they are going to have.

  8. #5468
    Blasted Conniving Roman General_BT's Avatar
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    Hey everyone! Thank you for all the comments and replies—there are quite a few once again to get through, thank you for being patient in waiting for them! Update is about a third of the way done—it’ll probably be posted Thursday or Friday, assuming all goes according to plan!

    Before we do that, I thought everyone would appreciate a little teaser as well. This is the heading for Book Three, which will (if all goes according to plan) start at the end of this chapter in the story:






    Tommy4ever – If the French had more of the gendarmes, they might have done better. As is, they are doing better—they’re making the Romans pay for every inch of land taken, and they managed to wound the Pandomestikos, taking him out of the equation. They didn’t collapse after a one defeat like the German/Polish force did. And all the loot pouring into Alexandros’ (and the Balkan dynatoi’s) coffers MUST be worrying Andronikos. How can he stop it though—Alexandros has Hesso, no one speaks for Germany…

    vadermath – Germany could be headed for a long, dark night—for sure, this is the probable end of the Arpad Empire as we know it. It’s run was long—it began in 1096, had a hiccup from the 1190s to the 1230s, then re-emerged. If the Arpads retain the throne, it’ll be in a more reduced status. There are other dynasties within Germany that could have the power to oust them, at least from their German lands…

    …Nikephoros has the stats, and the sense, to be a good ruler. Leprosy though…

    For the Romans, this would probably be known as the Frankish/German Campaign. Despite the setbacks in France, overall its gone far better than previous wars against France and her allies… the Megaloprepis had difficulties in Spain and Drogo II got all the way to Italy in the first matchup. The second Drogo crossed the Pyrenees, and Frankish armies intervened in at least one Roman civil war as well. The war in France has been hard and bloody, but its taken place across the Pyrenees, the primary goal of the entire remaking of the Roman armies in the 1250s and 1260s…

    Leviathan07 – If the Arpads were still simply in Hungary, they might be able to pull a Matthias Corvinus and raise something similar there. Germany and its chaos is dragging them down. Incidentally, the Gendarmesare partially ripped from the real life L’Ordonnace of Late-Medieval/Early Renaissance France. I saw a regular standing force based on mounted lances and a standard set of retainers being a middle ground between the Roman tagmata and the feudal levy. I couldn’t father why the French wouldn’t take that step towards a standing army with their primary enemy for the last century possessing one and using it effectively…

    Alexios I – Gabriel unfortunately died finally in 1284, still in exile, and before he could see his grandson “eat glory” and thumb his nose at Gabriel’s nemesis….

    Ksim3000 – Long time no see! Glad to see you’re still with us! I’m just not on AIM that often anymore, I’ve almost completely switched to Yahoo and MSN. I have to blush at the compliments, and a new banner is on its way! I’ve got to sort a few character pics first!

    Panjer – Considering he tamed Mesopotamia with a small army, and single-handedly undid the Holy Roman Empire possibly, one can put the mantle of ‘great’ on him already. All depends, however, if he keeps the mantle. It can be lost…

    FlyngDutchie – Alex really can decide the war’s face, since Hesso and many of the German nobility are his prisoner. He could end the war on terms of his own choosing, or he can let it go one and continue what has now become a plundering expedition. Conversely, Andronikos for sure is going to want the war ended as soon as possible—Spoils flowing directly into the hands of the nobility, as well as Alex, is a direct, dire threat to the monarchy. Would Alex really want to end things—or would he drag it out, trying to get as much plunder and glory that he can to ship back home?

    asd21593 – Alex wouldn’t face any organized resistance if he turned and rode west—there’d be logistics issues mostly, but these could be circumvented by breaking up his host and spreading it out. The big thing preventing him from getting to France is neutral Burgundy, who has a land strip almost down to Switzerland on the Rhine. Dietmar has so far stayed out of the fray…

    Zzzzz… – Once the war started, I’m sure Andronikos wouldn’t have liked anything better than to reduce the Holy Roman Emperor to nothing more than the King of the Germans permanently. Now, however, there’s some extenuating circumstances…

    Nikolai – The Romans would at least interpret it as something is seriously wrong, as the Emperor is almost a physical manifestation of God’s view of the Empire, however…

    The_Archduke – It wouldn’t necessarily completely disqualify him from the throne. In the case of a weaker present reigning emperor, that might be the case. Romanion has a long tradition of co-Emperors, however, and in this case, Andronikos simply has to raise Nikephoros to co-Emperor before dying. Afterwards, Nikephoros would need a co-Emperor of his own (like Manuel, and technically Thomas II), and that’s where things would get interesting. Who would rule alongside?

    Vesimir – Well, they’re working together in the names of glory, riches, and arguably vengeance. Though like above, I ask if Alexandros would make peace so quickly. He’s already in Germany, making an ever longer train of plunder behind his army. The money that flows south is making him suddenly and ridiculously popular with the Balkan dynatoi. Might he drag things out some, trying to squeeze the last bit of treasure from eastern Germany, Hungary, and Poland, before finally heading back? It’s a possibility…

    Enewald – Not really winning, more French fighting tooth and nail, something the Romans didn’t’ expect. Honestly Andornikos et al expected the situations to be reversed—a tough slugfest or temporary Roman defeat in the Balkans, versus the French cracking and breaking after one or two blows from the mighty Hispanikon. The gendarmerie and Alexandros changed things quite a bit from the plans!

    AlexanderPrimus – If the Mongols got involved, we’d be knocking on War of Spanish Succession territory maybe. Seven Years War if we push it. Not yet World War One though…

    TC Pilot – Well, there kind of was a plan. Hit the German force while it was disorganized, retreat behind the hidden spearline, let them Germans tire themselves out trying to break the spearline before their infantry came up. In the end the plan only needed about four hours, but it worked. Without the ‘heads’ of the army (captured, wounded or killed at Sisak) the rest of the force broke up and went home.

    If Sbyslava produces an heir, we’ll have something we had once before with Manuel—potential heirs from three different mothers. Manuel, during the chaos of the Third Turkish War managed to make sure the succession went smoothly into Basil’s hands (he was helped by the fact that the child by his first wife had no ambitions to rule, and the children by his third were still for the most part very young). Andronikos will have adult heirs from two mothers (Demetrios and Nikephoros from Cecilia, and as of 1290, Alexios from Doryotta, with others quickly following up). This isn’t taking into account what Manuel could do if he discovers his parentage as well. Demetrios already views himself as the most legitimate by being the eldest. Nikephoros having leprosy is only adding fuel to a pre-existing fire. Unless something is done, it’s only a matter of time before it turns into an inferno…

    Frrf – You were lucky. The entire event sounds like the ‘Great Floods of 1993’ I lived through here in the Central United States. Copious amounts of rain upstream making life miserable for hundreds of thousands downstream. We didn’t have major floodwaters cascading through a major city like what happened with Brisbane—most of the major cities on the Mississippi and Missouri rivers are protected by enormous levees.

    Alex, you can argue, is becoming a victim of success perhaps? He hasn’t tasted failure, which means there’s possibly a little voice in the back of his head saying “Go ahead, it’ll all be fine!” Even when it could turn out not to be…

    Kirsch27 – He’s still two behind good-old Richard Burton/Jonathan Rhys-Meyers. Alexandros is simply living up to his reckless trait—to the hilt!

    RGB – Yes, it would be the infectious leprosy. However, the disease in some cases remains visibly innocuous (tuberculoid) with one or two rashes on the surface being the only symptom. These versions can then evolve into the more severe ‘classic’ leprosy with skin lesions and granuloma. In Nikephoros’ case, he has the former kind… no telling if it will progress or if it will remain simply in tuberculoid form.

    1) Yes, it did, but Safiya’s avowed goal to mount Andronikos whether he wanted to or not probably had a role in that failure as well.
    2) Gottfried has to be cackling right now. He controls Pola, by now the third largest port on the Adriatic (behind Ragusa and, of course Venice). He’s in prime position to also charge Alex and others to ship their loot home by water… more money for him.
    3) The Gendarmes and their ilk are the feudal European response to the success of the tagma—they’re cheaper and easier to maintain, and while the tagma can beat them, it’s a close enough match that economically the gendarmes are arguably more viable. Look for others, even some of the dynatoi, to start copying and modifying the idea as time goes on.
    4) Hesso’s martial ability was a 5. His own marshal’s ability was a 9. Not exactly the brightest pair… especially when going up against someone with a 21 martial who has a 16 martial general as his second in command…
    5) Limp and needing a cane – check? Multiple wives? – check. Ego big enough to set about destroying the church? – Not yet so far…
    6) It’s a tradition. There’s always a Battle at Poitiers!

    Qorten – Yup it’s for certain leprosy. Andronikos’ family life has arguably been nothing but tragedy—he lost his father when he was an infant, he lost the woman he loved not too far into their marriage, now his son by her has leprosy. He’s gotta assume God has something against him almost…

    Carldstadt Boy – For some reason in the update I had Sisak, and then in the title and a couple places I wrote “Sistak.” Not sure where the mixup took place, but thanks for catching that!

    Christian V – It wouldn’t be the first time someone physically imperfect who wasn’t support to rule took the purple. One of the Konstantinos’ was deposed, and had his nose cut off in order to make him ineligible to rule. He simply got a gold nose, raised an army, and deposed the usurper, reigning a while longer as “the Slit-Nosed.” However, the more religious among the Romans certainly wouldn’t be viewing a leper-emperor as a good sign… God is angry, they would say…
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  9. #5469
    *gasps*

    And to think I came in here just now to ask when we'll be entering a new book! I quietly whispered "Holy shit" to no-one in particular upon seeing the next book banner. I must say BT, no story has immersed me as much as your work of art has; I stopped reading this as a simple AAR long ago. Right now, I genuinely wonder what will happen to this incredible world you've created. Also, can we hope for a few more interims at the end of this book?

  10. #5470
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    Does that mean we'll get a reign summary for the three co-emperors now? don't mean to be a pest...

  11. #5471
    Slacker Extraordinaire Zzzzz...'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by General_BT View Post
    Sooo pwetty!!! Will this be the last book in CK?

    EDIT: BT, the link for your table of contents doesn't work or is it just me? Thanks!
    Last edited by Zzzzz...; 25-01-2011 at 00:30.
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  12. #5472
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    This AAR, or multivolume series, continues to be awesome. I’m curious to see what you’ll do once you hit the EUIII era, since EUIII doesn’t lend itself nearly as well to character building. Do you know what country you’re going to play yet?

    Gabriel’s departure from Persia was one of the best scenes. I was never that fond of the character, but I certainly agree with him that Gabriel Soter is a far better title than the inane Megas Komnenos.

    Alexandros seemed to copying his Macedonian namesake a bit too closely. I think someone needs to remind him what nearly happened to the original Alexandros Megas at the Granicus. Hopefully he’ll calm down a bit and make it past his thirties.

    What’s going on in northern Russia? Does a fur clad prince walk the snowy streets of Novgorod, musing over past glories and dreaming of future triumphs, of resurrecting from the ashes the once mighty Kingdom of the Rus? Or am I just being hopelessly optimistic?
    One of the best safeguards that a ruler has against plots is not being hated by the people.-Machiavelli, The Prince

  13. #5473
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    Erm... BT. Your new graphic is really cool, but shouldn't it be Book 4 rather than book 3?
    Not trying to be picky or anything.

  14. #5474
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    Frrf - THANK YOU! I missed that... yes it should be Book Four--good catch!. So here is the corrected banner:



    Basilieus444 - Once I hit EU3, I'll have no choice but to go history book I think. I'm planning on releasing an EU3 mod for this so others can play whatever countries they want. Chances are I'll try to report on the rest of the world even as I play my one country. I'm actually leaning towards non-Romanion, and going Mali...

    North Russia is split, but under the sway of Novgorod, though "Bohemia" is still hanging around as well. Once we hit the next gap between emperors I plan on doing a world update on all the various parts of Europe.

    Zzzzz... - It worked just fine for me when I tested it... Anyone else having that problem?

    Alexios I - When Andronikos dies, yes. I've meant to do one, and it kept getting put off and put off. I promise there'll be one--if not, you can take your e-pitchfork and chase after me!

    vadermath - It took me about five minutes to make that from pics I found on the internet--blue and orange go well together, and it shows in the picture. I think it sums up nicely what's coming--Imperial Collapse, the Black Death, in short, the End of All Things to the average person...

    Incidentally, I just finished the new regnal banner tonight as well. So here's another teaser--the last banner for our good friend Andronikos...

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  15. #5475
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    Basilieus444 - Once I hit EU3, I'll have no choice but to go history book I think. I'm planning on releasing an EU3 mod for this so others can play whatever countries they want. Chances are I'll try to report on the rest of the world even as I play my one country. I'm actually leaning towards non-Romanion, and going Mali...
    Please. No. Just no. This is an AAR about Romaion! You need to continue as Romaion or one of its Roman successor states!
    Fear not, for I am with you; Be not dismayed, for I am your God. -Isa 41:10

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  16. #5476
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    I agree. The story is about the Roman Empire, not Mali. Maybe you could play as Persia and finally take back Konstantinopolis.

    And a little question: is the mod going to be for HttT or Divine Wind?

  17. #5477
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    You already said a long time ago that this is a Constantinople AAR as you'll be playing anyone who's controlling The City of Lights. So none of this Mali nonsense! Unless they take the City that is.

    And if Nazguls are going to start roaming Europe then the world has indeed came to an end.
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  18. #5478
    Awww, history-book style? I usually love those, but this is such an incredible narrative, I think switching styles would be a waste. And to repeat the question Zzzz posted above, is this the last CK book?

  19. #5479
    I fully support playing with whoever controls the Constantinople. Queen of cities is the heart and soul of the Empire, no empire could be the same without it.
    And writing Roma Arisen as Mali would be very weird to say the least.

    Besides, decrepit and powerless Empire would probably be very fun to read about. Of course, only until new rise of Rome begins.

    P.S. Small request - please give us some awesome naval battles in EU3.
    P.P.S. Will you continue this beyond EU? Byzantine dreadnoughts would be even cooler.
    Last edited by Carlstadt Boy; 25-01-2011 at 17:34.

  20. #5480
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    Quote Originally Posted by General_BT View Post
    He’s still two behind good-old Richard Burton/Jonathan Rhys-Meyers.
    I may be mistaken, but I think you mean Paul Scofield instead of Richard Burton. (At least, that's who played old "Stauriakos.")

    Quote Originally Posted by General_BT View Post
    Chances are I'll try to report on the rest of the world even as I play my one country. I'm actually leaning towards non-Romanion, and going Mali...
    Well, that's one of the benefits of playing EU3, isn't it? If you get seriously burned out playing Romanion, you can always save and reload as whoever you want, be it Mali, or Sortmark, or Persia, or (heaven forbid) the Iroquois. Though I imagine you'll at least be pursuing chapters that will be pertinent to your central narrative.

    Everything is looking great, by the way. Your recent updates have been superb, and your latest graphics look stellar. I can't wait to see what happens next!

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