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Apart from "I will return..." what was the strategic reason for America invading the Phillipines?

In terms of a war winning strategy it was a sideshow, much as New Guinea and Burma were.

I fear we're trying from the narrative of the AAR. However, I'll try to suggest an answer or two.

The Philippines were US territory and there's a strong part of no part of my country shall remain occuppied. If the Philippines had not been liberated , the Filiinos would have concluded that the US promise of independence was false.

New Guinea was a bastion preventing the fall of Australia.

The Japanese need to be encouraged to put effort into defending their empire. They had to be convinced that their conquered territories that provided tthem with their raw materials were the allied target. Once the allies had them back, they could blockade Japan and starve them into surrender.

It was the dual approach that forced the Japanes to split their forces. Victory over the Japanese in Burma and the Philippines proved that the Japanese were no longer masters of the battlefield.

And Kaisermuffin, you're doing it again. The Monty v Patton debate is another that just descends into flame and personal attacks. If there comes to be a time where such a discussion based on events in the AAR and arguments are marshalled solely from the evidence presented in this AAR, we can then debate the relative merits of one over the other. Til then, it's not somewhere any of us ought to go.

Oh, another vote for tractors.
 
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And Kaisermuffin, you're doing it again. The Monty v Patton debate is another that just descends into flame and personal attacks. If there comes to be a time where such a discussion based on events in the AAR and arguments are marshalled solely from the evidence presented in this AAR, we can then debate the relative merits of one over the other. Til then, it's not somewhere any of us ought to go.

Consarn it man. I posted it precisely for humourous effect, well aware of how miserable people can get over such things. It was sarcasm. :rolleyes:

+1 Spain
 
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Apart from "I will return..." what was the strategic reason for America invading the Phillipines?

In terms of a war winning strategy it was a sideshow, much as New Guinea and Burma were.

Was it? It and Burma were the two theaters where the Allies managed to tie down a significant number of Japanese troops, troops that had they been in China in 1944, could have been the tipping point in crushing the Nationalists. Besides that, had Burma been a static theater, there would have been no Chinese Lend-Lease except for the nearly prohibitively expensive airlift. The island hopping strategy would have probably become more expensive in men and materiel to conduct as well.

With the Brits having a more forward-thinking mindset on Singapore and Burma however, we'd probably see the Japanese possibly gambling to not engage the Americans... which would be geopolitically interesting.
 
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Apart from "I will return..." what was the strategic reason for America invading the Phillipines?

In terms of a war winning strategy it was a sideshow, much as New Guinea and Burma were.

I wouldn't know about the Phillipines or Burma, but New Guinea was important because allowing the Japanese to control it would allow them to invade Australia, a dangerous prospect. Taking New Guinea would also allow the allies to retake Borneo and Sumatra, from which the Japanese were extracting the crucial oil to fuel their navy and air force. Without those oil wells, Japan would have failed its war aims and could be starved into submission.

I'm sure Burma has similar value for denying Japan from knocking another ally out of the war, and denying them resources they desperately needed.
 
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I am caught up and I thank you for the tank pron. What are we voting on and are the polls still open?

Vann
 
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Vann, it's easy. Just repeat after me and click your red shoes three times:

There's no pron like tractors, there's no pron like tractors, there's no pron like tractors.....

+1 tractors
 
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I wouldn't know about the Phillipines or Burma, but New Guinea was important because allowing the Japanese to control it would allow them to invade Australia, a dangerous prospect. Taking New Guinea would also allow the allies to retake Borneo and Sumatra, from which the Japanese were extracting the crucial oil to fuel their navy and air force. Without those oil wells, Japan would have failed its war aims and could be starved into submission.

I'm sure Burma has similar value for denying Japan from knocking another ally out of the war, and denying them resources they desperately needed.
I'm not sure I would say the Japanese ever had a hope in hell of seriously invading Australia. However, conquering New Guinea would have given them the bases to seriously interdict any efforts to resupply Australia (thus neutering the Ozzies significantly, and forcing them to keep most of their forces at home, to defend against any invasion threat, real or not).

And oh yes: Rah! Boo! Hiss! Etc against MacArthur.

And before I forget: Tractors + 1
 
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Thought for the day...

Pearl Harbour was bombed at dawn. The Phillipines were also bombed at dawn. The dawn at Pearl Harbour is several hours before dawn in the Phillipines...

So, ponder why the USAAF got caught on the ground and destroyed on Day 1...

Oh, and +1 Republican Spain.

Dury.
 
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merrick;10930503Oh said:
Nathan Madien[/B] - it was named after "Matilda the Comical Duck" which was apparently a popular cartoon in '30s Britain. Someone looked at the A11 and saw a resemblance...

Thank you very much. :)

Thought for the day...

Pearl Harbour was bombed at dawn. The Phillipines were also bombed at dawn. The dawn at Pearl Harbour is several hours before dawn in the Phillipines...

So, ponder why the USAAF got caught on the ground and destroyed on Day 1

Dury is on to something. The Japanese aren't our real enemy. Dawn is! Let's get her!

Oh, yeah. I vote for Landon. Like Dewey in '48, I refuse to change my strategy.
 
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Dury is on to something. The Japanese aren't our real enemy. Dawn is! Let's get her!

Reminds me of Russel Crowe's attempts to fight cancer in South Park... :D

+1 Republican Spain.

Dury.
 
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US Politics +1

We're already discussing the possibilities for MacArthur in this timeline...<peers around the last batch of posts>...I see no conjecture on spain, or tractors...

C'mon Pip...the people are speaking, they're just not voting well!
:cool:
 
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Tractors +1

Japanese invasion of Australia is pure madness. Where would troops and shipping for that come (compare with this - http://www.combinedfleet.com/pearlops.htm)?

New Guinea had to be held because of fear of Japanese invasion and threat to lines of communication to US (which was very realistic). Battles for Guadalcanal and New Guinea were only a start of Japanese plan to cut off Australia and neutralize it that way.
 
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Dury is on to something. The Japanese aren't our real enemy. Dawn is! Let's get her!

That's what Buffynistas have been saying since season 5.

+1 Tractors.

And Dawn votes for tractors as well.
 
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Thought for the day...

Pearl Harbour was bombed at dawn. The Phillipines were also bombed at dawn. The dawn at Pearl Harbour is several hours before dawn in the Phillipines...

So, ponder why the USAAF got caught on the ground and destroyed on Day 1...

Oh, and +1 Republican Spain.

Dury.

Communications failure. Similar strikes to cripple communications were done at Guam and Wake, the two stations that were responsible for transmitting information towards the Philippines.

News of Pearl Harbor did not reach the Philippines until noon local time, approx late afternoon in Hawaii.

EDIT: +1 for TRACTORS
 
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Communications failure. Similar strikes to cripple communications were done at Guam and Wake, the two stations that were responsible for transmitting information towards the Philippines.

News of Pearl Harbor did not reach the Philippines until noon local time, approx late afternoon in Hawaii.
MacArthur had ordered the planes at Clark Field to rebase to Mindanao (out of range of Japanese strikes) a few days earlier - and had never checked to make sure his orders had been carried out.

On the wider scale, the "island hopping" approach to Japan across the Central Pacific was a very late development, strategically speaking, as was the realisation that the Japanese empire could be crippled by submarines and strategic bombing, without having to invade most of it directly. The original plans assumed China would be a major ally (the Burma campaign was largely fought for control of the "Burma Road" to China) and that any invasion of the Home Islands would require control of a major port in the vicinity.

Hence the New Guinea campaign was (in American eyes anyway) fought less to defend the approaches to Australia (the main route went through New Caledonia, which was never seriously threatened) but to secure the approaches to the Philippines. From the Philippines they would go to Taiwan, then on to the South China coast, hook up with Chinese (and British and American) forces coming from Chungking and Burma, clear the Chinese coast, advance into Manchuria and finally invade Japan from Korea! Estimated time of arrival 1948 or so. In practice the plan got rather overtaken by events, but by that time the forces were already in-theatre and it went against the grain for the Americans (and British) to leave their territory (and the rubber of Malaya and the Philippines and the oil of Burma and the East Indies) in Japanese hands when they had the resources for an offensive.

Oh and +1 for Spain and +lots for speedy updates. ;)
 
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Communications failure. Similar strikes to cripple communications were done at Guam and Wake, the two stations that were responsible for transmitting information towards the Philippines.

News of Pearl Harbor did not reach the Philippines until noon local time, approx late afternoon in Hawaii.

EDIT: +1 for TRACTORS

Utter crap... and I'm not talking about your vote for tractors either! :D

Pearl was hit first, it was still pre dawn on Guam and Wake. They weren't hit until after the signal "Air raid, Pearl Harbour. This is not a drill" was sent out by the commander of Ford Naval Station.

The signal got through, at 2.30am Manila time, and Admiral Hart was up at 3am dispersing his vessels. General Brereton was requesting permission to bomb Formosa from shortly after but didn't get it until 11am and his planes were on the ground arming when the Japanese appeared overhead at 12.40pm (they'd been delayed by fog on Formosa). [source: The Pacific Campaign by Dan Van Der Vat, pg 26-30]

Hmm, seems I can't blame Dawn after all... back to MacArthur then...

+1 Republican Spain.

Dury.
 
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