Goodie. So I am not the only one who can't stand that whole Bismarck crap any longer.
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gaiasabre11 - Already making an arse of yourself. A new record! As for Hood, at least she fought rather than cowardly changing sides then hiding in port.
I'm not making an arse of myself, I'm just being realistic. Everyone knows that the Hood is a fine ship, and a good match for the Bismarck. Now if you disagree with that you'll be making an arse of yourself.
Hiding in port? Nah. They were just enjoying wine and watching you guys fighting it out.
However, you know what happened when they did fight. (Now I say just leave things like this and get back your updates. )- 1
trekaddict - In fairness 60 years of propaganda from both sides bigging the ship up (admittedly for different reasons) has produced one hell a reputation that I don't think any reality could live up to.
However when Bismark and her sisters make an appearance (I've checked the German build queue so I'm sure they will) there will be a slightly more rational judgement on the ships; large WW1 battleships with new engines and modern(ish) guns.
However when Bismark and her sisters make an appearance (I've checked the German build queue so I'm sure they will) there will be a slightly more rational judgement on the ships; large WW1 battleships with new engines and modern(ish) guns.
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I think the hype around Bismarck makes some sort of showdown between her and the RN in any UK or German AAR inevitable. Hell, even I fell victim to that.
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What I think is funny about the Bismarck is that you had this big powerful modern battleship which scared the living daylights out of the British...and it was turned into a sitting duck by an outdated biplane.
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Have to disagree Pip, old boy!
We didn't have the service numbers in the RAN to take in anywhere near that many ships at once. Also, for an organisation that saw itself operating as part of the RN, I think that Australia would have serious concerns about technology that wasn't compatible. We'd say thanks but no thanks, we only buy British! The RN would also support that view, wouldn't want to encourage independant operations and all that!
I think it's far more likely that the RN hold onto them and someone uses them to try and horsetrade with the Turks or a South American ally later on...
Dury.
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Well, that is still considered a lucky (unlucky) shot. You don't have torpedoes hitting your rudder (groin
) all the time.But this also tells us something: Bismarck's AA capabilities sucks.
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A could see the RAN using the ex-RM ships for training purposes [on loan as it were], or even radically rebuilding them for other purposes (such as fleet support (fast oilers/supplies), monitors, seaplane tenders or even small escourt carriers.
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trekaddict - Then I may have to have her sink the entire French fleet then succumb to a RN submarine.
Nathan Madien - I think it was perfectly apt, an outdated battleship humbled by an outdated biplane. Worked for me.
Duritz - Good points. My original thought was that as all the ships were damaged, three of them down to ~50% strength, that they'd be rebuilt with British equipment making them 'compatible'. Then the RAN would probably man two of them and use the rest as spares hulks for the non-British parts.
However thinking about it that could end up being as expensive as just building two new cruisers. As you say perhaps they'd do better service being sold on to a third party.
Sir Humphrey - I think those hit the same problem, the refit could end up being almost as expensive as a new build. Even then you still have a metric sized ship which is going to make maintenance more expensive and parts tricky.
If the RAN did want a training ship or a cruiser hull to rebuild then they'd be better of with one of the Hawkins-class currently sitting in reserve. Sure they're a little older and a little smaller, but being Imperial sized they'd be far cheaper to run and easier to maintain.
Damned reality ruining cool ideas.
Nathan Madien - I think it was perfectly apt, an outdated battleship humbled by an outdated biplane. Worked for me.
Duritz - Good points. My original thought was that as all the ships were damaged, three of them down to ~50% strength, that they'd be rebuilt with British equipment making them 'compatible'. Then the RAN would probably man two of them and use the rest as spares hulks for the non-British parts.
However thinking about it that could end up being as expensive as just building two new cruisers. As you say perhaps they'd do better service being sold on to a third party.
Sir Humphrey - I think those hit the same problem, the refit could end up being almost as expensive as a new build. Even then you still have a metric sized ship which is going to make maintenance more expensive and parts tricky.
If the RAN did want a training ship or a cruiser hull to rebuild then they'd be better of with one of the Hawkins-class currently sitting in reserve. Sure they're a little older and a little smaller, but being Imperial sized they'd be far cheaper to run and easier to maintain.
Damned reality ruining cool ideas.
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Could always use 'em to create/extend an artificial harbour somewhere in the Pacific, or like has been suggested, sell them off to someone, probably in South America. Or use them as prison hulks on the Thames.
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trekaddict - Then I may have to have her sink the entire French fleet then succumb to a RN submarine.
I have something like this prepared for my AAR (obviously with changing roles
) but more awesome. However, you will definitely be using the word "blasphemy" a lot if you do read it by the time my AAR gets to that point.- 1
I have something like this prepared for my AAR (obviously with changing roles
Then you probably shouldn't read the next update in mine then.
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I'll still read it, since I'm good at coping with shocks. Plus I'm sure that mine can give you more shock then yours can give me.
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I'm not sure that the Bismarcks AA abilities suck. I read somewhere that the biplanes used were slow enough that you didn't need to lead the target. The German gunners didn't know that though. :wacko:
Great AAR by the way El Pid.
Great AAR by the way El Pid.
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Seems sale of the Italian ships might be best. Was Italy "ahead" in any particular areas of ship design where DNC could learn a thing or two?
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Excellent update Pippy, looking forward to the RAF/Army deployments.
one thing , looking at your fleet deployment list, am i right in assuming the China station has been disbanded/amalgamated with the Far East Fleet?
later, Caff
one thing , looking at your fleet deployment list, am i right in assuming the China station has been disbanded/amalgamated with the Far East Fleet?
later, Caff
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Sir Humphrey - Block ships are tempting, nothing insults your former enemy more than saying his bests ships are good for nothing more than sinking. However I think cold, hard cash wins out, so selling is the way to go.
trekaddict - I just did, it was a spiffing update.
Maximus101 - The problem with the AA was the multiple levels of weaponry and conflicting directors and systems, none of which worked particularly well together. Even the best trained and experienced gunners in the world would have struggled to make it work, regardless of target.
DonnieBaseball - The Regia Marina did speed very well in her light cruisers, not something the RN is going to be much interested in (apart from to confirm their dislike of ships that sacrifice too much for speed).
On the other hand the Zara's were very well balanced ships, short legged perhaps and they certainly could have done with a radar superstructure but overall a good use of the 12,000 tonnes. Given the County's were trade cruisers not fleet units there could be some lessons there on design, though perhaps not equipment.
However I think the next RN heavy cruisers will probably be for carrier escort work, I can't see the Admiralty 'wasting' battleships or battle-cruisers on such duties so there will need to be some heavy units. Something like the US Witchitas possibly, which were a good 50% larger than the Zaras so I'm not sure if anything would apply.
caffran - China Station is still there in writing terms, I just didn't list all the small cruiser only stations (South Atlantic, America & West Indies, East Indies, etc). Thought that was probably too much detail.
Hopefully the rest of the services can be as interesting.
trekaddict - I just did, it was a spiffing update.
Maximus101 - The problem with the AA was the multiple levels of weaponry and conflicting directors and systems, none of which worked particularly well together. Even the best trained and experienced gunners in the world would have struggled to make it work, regardless of target.
DonnieBaseball - The Regia Marina did speed very well in her light cruisers, not something the RN is going to be much interested in (apart from to confirm their dislike of ships that sacrifice too much for speed).
On the other hand the Zara's were very well balanced ships, short legged perhaps and they certainly could have done with a radar superstructure but overall a good use of the 12,000 tonnes. Given the County's were trade cruisers not fleet units there could be some lessons there on design, though perhaps not equipment.
However I think the next RN heavy cruisers will probably be for carrier escort work, I can't see the Admiralty 'wasting' battleships or battle-cruisers on such duties so there will need to be some heavy units. Something like the US Witchitas possibly, which were a good 50% larger than the Zaras so I'm not sure if anything would apply.
caffran - China Station is still there in writing terms, I just didn't list all the small cruiser only stations (South Atlantic, America & West Indies, East Indies, etc). Thought that was probably too much detail.
Hopefully the rest of the services can be as interesting.
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Very nice update there. I really do envy your concise writing ability. The Eastern Fleet may be under strength to handle the IJN if the Japanese should choose to go south but the real question usually boils down to who is in command of the fleet available.
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