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Thread: Stalin and Lenin

  1. #1

    Talking Stalin and Lenin

    Now, I realize that Stalin would have sent his Grandma to Siberia in order to stay in power, but I was wondering about his relationship to Lenin and his feelings about the man?

    Did he genuinely admire him? (I find this hard to believe, Stalin seemed extremely self-absorbed) What did he say about Lenin after he died? Did Stalin think of Lenin as a greater man than himself, or just his predecessor?

  2. #2
    During first months of barbarossa Stalin said "What Lenin created we've lost forever". Anyway I think power was the main thing to him, not ideology.

  3. #3

    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by epas
    During first months of barbarossa Stalin said "What Lenin created we've lost forever". Anyway I think power was the main thing to him, not ideology.
    Hey, I just read that today! In Alan Clarke's "Barbarossa: The Russian-German Conflict." That book really is pretty good.

    Thats why I asked the question, BTW.

  4. #4
    Oh energy where art thou? R.F.A's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lenin
    "That man must never get to power"
    /Lenin on Stalin.

    That quote is not exact, but it is something like that.
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  5. #5
    Captain li2co3's Avatar
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    Are we talking about young stalin, middle stalin or late stalin? Its important.

    Early Stalin before October 1917 was on the right of the Party. Lenin was more, um, opportunist, in his ideology. Though over the issue of Party, Liquidationalism, Internationalism and Revolutionism Lenin and Stalin had different positions. Most notably Lenin went Stalin's throat over Stalin's handling of Petrograd, and Stalin's anti-revolutionism in 1917. (Significantly, Lenin welcomed Trostky's revolutionist faction to the Bolshevik party at this period).

    During the Civil War Stalin followed party line.

    Immediately after Lenin's death, Stalin's line retained a right position against Trotsky, then a left position against his rightist allies.. then continued flip flopping until his death. Stalin's political arguments were primarily centred around power to the General Secretary, and the organs under his influence. Lenin's political arguments had always been about revolution in Russia and the World. So we can compare Stalin and Lenin's opportunism on the basis of their goals.

    In his late period, 1933 onwards, Lenin was merely a figure head to legitimise Soviet society. When inconvienient, the opportunist shed Lenin and took up Great Russian Nationalism or even the orthodox church.

    (While this article may sound sympathetic to Lenin, I also revile Lenin for his corruption of the Soviets).
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  6. #6
    Knower of Things Razgovory's Avatar
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    Stalin would not be what we consider today "mentally healthy". I'm not saying he was insane (that would imply that he is incapable of funtioning) but he had serious problems. I don't think Stalin really liked anyone all that well. Except his daughter. His son's were terrified of him, and he thought them failures, he had no respect for his wife (who he drove to suicide or killed, depending on who you talk to), He even felt betrayed by his mother for sending him to seminary school. He didn't seem to have much capacity of love or even mild liking of other human beings. I doubt he liked Lenin all that well. It just wouldn't be in his character.
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  7. #7
    Rube 001 cdat's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Razgovory
    Stalin would not be what we consider today "mentally healthy". I'm not saying he was insane (that would imply that he is incapable of funtioning) but he had serious problems. I don't think Stalin really liked anyone all that well. Except his daughter. His son's were terrified of him, and he thought them failures, he had no respect for his wife (who he drove to suicide or killed, depending on who you talk to), He even felt betrayed by his mother for sending him to seminary school. He didn't seem to have much capacity of love or even mild liking of other human beings. I doubt he liked Lenin all that well. It just wouldn't be in his character.
    Maybe Lenin fit his idea of what a man should be. He despised his sons, you said. Possible, because they couldn't be as great?
    ...

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by SecondReich
    Did he genuinely admire him? (I find this hard to believe, Stalin seemed extremely self-absorbed) What did he say about Lenin after he died? Did Stalin think of Lenin as a greater man than himself, or just his predecessor?
    There is this joke about what Stalin said to Lenin in his deathbed:

    Lenin is dying, and talking things over with Stalin, his successor.
    "The one worry I have," says Lenin, "is this: will the people follow you? What do you think, comrade Stalin?"
    "They will," says Stalin, "they surely will."
    "I hope so," says Lenin, "but what if they don't follow you?"
    "No problem," says Stalin, "then they'll follow you."

  9. #9
    Stalin says speach. Someone coughs in hall.
    Stalin: Who has coughed?
    Theres a silent in hall.
    Stalin: Take the men in first line of seats out.
    Take the men in secon line of seats out.
    Take the men in third line of seats out.
    Then on sceard man stands up and says: I
    Stalin: To your health.

    Sory for my english.

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