Avoiding 1848 revolutions

[Arado]

From what I understand, we can "ride out" the revolutions for about 4 years when playing as Prussia. However, are players still able to tone down the revolutions if they choose to go with universal suffrage? This seemed to work in 1.01.

Arado

[J.J.E.]

I believe you can avoid the 1848 rebellions with universal suffrage yes, but then, as prussia, you will experience the Bismarck counterrevolution which is much worse. Am I correct?

[WiWi Walker]

There are more ways to avoid the liberal revolution event.
look into the global revolution event-data. If i remember correct, for prussia it is enough to change the press rights. There are many posibilities to avoid this, without becoming a constitutionel monarchie.
I hope i am correct but this way i had no revolution.

[Derek Pullem]

I believe you can avoid the 1848 rebellions with universal suffrage yes, but then, as prussia, you will experience the Bismarck counterrevolution which is much worse. Am I correct?

The counter revolution is not certain (3% ish every month for 4 years I think) but likely.

The liberal triggers have changed so that you either have to have wealth voting rights or allow socilaist trade unions - both unlikely with a monarchy

[Arado]

The counter revolution is not certain (3% ish every month for 4 years I think) but likely.

The liberal triggers have changed so that you either have to have wealth voting rights or allow socilaist trade unions - both unlikely with a monarchy

I see. So we have a chance of having a counter revolution if we do universal suffrage, but this won't happen if we ride it out? Or will the 3% be always there between 1848-1852. There's one thing I still don't understand and that is why is it better to ride it out with no liberal reforms between 1848 and 1852 if there's only a 3% chance of counter rev.? Are revolution durations different in 1.03?

Arado

[Becephalus]

Are you surethe 4 years are not earlier? I got some pretty severe revoltions with SP from 1846-1850

[Derek Pullem]

I see. So we have a chance of having a counter revolution if we do universal suffrage, but this won't happen if we ride it out? Or will the 3% be always there between 1848-1852. There's one thing I still don't understand and that is why is it better to ride it out with no liberal reforms between 1848 and 1852 if there's only a 3% chance of counter rev.? Are revolution durations different in 1.03?

Arado

The counter revolution is an event which raises conc/mil by approx +3 across the POPS.

So if you go democratic early then it is probable you'll get the counter-revolution (3% every 40/48 days = vitually certainty after 4 years). So youve avoided the liberal revolution in exchange for the counter revolution

Liberal revolution ends with a conc/mil reduction of -3/-4 approx.

Counter revolution effects are permanent.

Thats why I prefer to tough out the liberal revolution.

[WiWi Walker]

Derek, I only introduced free press to prussia and i never saw a liberal revolution and i am still a monarchie. The date now is 1853.

[Arado]

Derek, I only introduced free press to prussia and i never saw a liberal revolution and i am still a monarchie. The date now is 1853.

Let me follow up: will WiWi's strategy still trigger counter revolution?

Arado

[Derek Pullem]

No - but I think he was lucky - the liberal trigger doesn't mention free press now. I had no reforms in last nights game and got the liberal revolution

[WiWi Walker]

Ok, then i misunderstood the Event file.
(i am clueless and cant read a textfile... )
I thought that one opportunity was the combination of the right to ban parties and Free Press.
So I introduced free press and thought that i was right because the Event never triggered.
So i feel very sorry if i had spread false information around the forum.


# Global Revolutions

#META#1- The Liberal Revolution (Trigger: 1845+,lack of specified Political Reforms, ?Monarchy?)
# A) The Revolts are spreading [POPs 4-6=Con+5,Mil+7/POP 9= Mil+5]

# The Liberal Revolution
event = {
id = 25000
random = no
invention = yes

trigger = {
civilized = yes
NOT = { government = { type = liberal } }
NOT = { government = { type = anarcho_liberal } }
NOT = { constitution = { type = democracy } }
NOT = { reform = { type = trade_unions level = socialist } }
NOT = { reform = { type = trade_unions level = all } }
NOT = { reform = { type = voting_rights level = wealth } }
NOT = { reform = { type = voting_rights level = suffrage } }
NOT = {
OR = {
AND = {
reform = { type = press_rights level = free_press }
reform = { type = political_parties level = right_to_ban } }
AND = {
reform = { type = press_rights level = free_press }
reform = { type = political_parties level = all_allowed }
}
AND = {
reform = { type = press_rights level = censorship }
reform = { type = political_parties level = right_to_ban }
}
AND = {
reform = { type = press_rights level = censorship }
reform = { type = political_parties level = all_allowed }
}
}
}
NOT = { local_flag = { name = LIBERAL_REVOLUTION value = 1 } }

}

date = { day = 21 month = february year = 1845 }
offset = 25
deathdate = { day = 30 month = december year = 1920 }

name = "EVT_25000_NAME"
desc = "EVT_25000_DESC"


action_a = {
name = "ACTIONNAME25000A" # The Revolts are spreading
command = { type = pop_consciousness which = capitalists value = 5 }
command = { type = pop_consciousness which = clerks value = 5 }
command = { type = pop_consciousness which = craftsmen value = 5 }
command = { type = pop_militancy which = capitalists value = 3 }
command = { type = pop_militancy which = clerks value = 3 }
command = { type = pop_militancy which = craftsmen value = 3 }
command = { type = pop_militancy which = labourers value = 3 }
command = { type = local_setflag which = LIBERAL_REVOLUTION value = 2 }
command = { type = plurality value = 20 }

}
}

[BiB]

AND = {
reform = { type = press_rights level = censorship }
reform = { type = political_parties level = right_to_ban }

This one worked nicely for me last night.

[Derek Pullem]

No - don't apologise. I should apologise.

I believe you are correct in that you can avoid the liberal revolution simply by instigating a free press (or indeed censorship) and permitting political parties.

What I can't remember is if you can have political parties without elections?

[BiB]

Depends what u mean, in my current game as Germany (monarchy evidently) I have loads of political parties (right to ban, multi party) but noone has voting rights so I basically just get to pick

[Arado]

No - don't apologise. I should apologise.

I believe you are correct in that you can avoid the liberal revolution simply by instigating a free press (or indeed censorship) and permitting political parties.

What I can't remember is if you can have political parties without elections?

Thats good to know!!! I tried to read the text file, but I coulnt understand what it was saying. If we have a free press and permit all political parties, we will not have the liberal revolution unless........???? or can you always get away with it this way? Also, can you have a counter revolution without a liberal revolution, or you need one for the other?

Thanks for the answers
Arado

[WiWi Walker]

I will try to help you.

These are possible combinations of Reforms to avoid the liberal revolution:

No.1
press_rights level = free_press
political_parties level = right_to_ban

No.2
press_rights level = free_press
political_parties level = all_allowed

No.3
press_rights level = censorship
political_parties level = right_to_ban

No.4
press_rights level = censorship
political_parties level = all_allowed

The lib. revolution will also NOT trigger when you have one of the following ruling parties or constitutions:

government = liberal
government = anarcho_liberal
constitution = democracy

It will also not trigger when you have one of these reforms:
trade_unions level = socialist
trade_unions level = all
voting_rights level = wealth
voting_rights level = suffrage


The counter revolution can hit you if you are no monarchie anymore.

For example: When you become a democracy you avoid the liberal revolution, but there is a risk, that you will see the counter revolution.

Hope this answers your question. Otherwise fell free to ask again.

[Darkrenown]

Damn, I listened to Derek and sat through the liberal revolution instead of getting censorship/right to ban. Next time I trust the .txt files over the mod

[Arado]

I will try to help you.

These are possible combinations of Reforms to avoid the liberal revolution:

No.1
press_rights level = free_press
political_parties level = right_to_ban

No.2
press_rights level = free_press
political_parties level = all_allowed

No.3
press_rights level = censorship
political_parties level = right_to_ban

No.4
press_rights level = censorship
political_parties level = all_allowed

The lib. revolution will also NOT trigger when you have one of the following ruling parties or constitutions:

government = liberal
government = anarcho_liberal
constitution = democracy

It will also not trigger when you have one of these reforms:
trade_unions level = socialist
trade_unions level = all
voting_rights level = wealth
voting_rights level = suffrage


The counter revolution can hit you if you are no monarchie anymore.

For example: When you become a democracy you avoid the liberal revolution, but there is a risk, that you will see the counter revolution.

Hope this answers your question. Otherwise fell free to ask again.

Thanks! That helps. I do have one problem remaining. My last game, I had u. suffrage but the liberal revolts still came into effect. Is there a random element to this?

Arado

[WiWi Walker]

Sorry, when i tell you that i must kill you. Its a secret

....
OK, back to Topic
No, i am sorry, i have no explanation for that. It could be that i misunderstood some parts of the textfile. I am no expert in this (like Derek ). It just seems to me logical to work that way. Perhaps you are right and there is a random element... but i don t believe so.

[Derek Pullem]

Thanks! That helps. I do have one problem remaining. My last game, I had u. suffrage but the liberal revolts still came into effect. Is there a random element to this?

Arado

Universal sufferage does not make you a democracy in some cases - it makes you a Constitutional Monarchy. Prussia (and other traditional monarchies) is a case in point. This is a 1.03 change.

Anti-royalist liberals?