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Thread: Avoiding 1848 revolutions

  1. #1

    Avoiding 1848 revolutions

    From what I understand, we can "ride out" the revolutions for about 4 years when playing as Prussia. However, are players still able to tone down the revolutions if they choose to go with universal suffrage? This seemed to work in 1.01.

    Arado

  2. #2
    In Exile J.J.E.'s Avatar
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    I believe you can avoid the 1848 rebellions with universal suffrage yes, but then, as prussia, you will experience the Bismarck counterrevolution which is much worse. Am I correct?
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    Second Lieutenant WiWi Walker's Avatar

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    There are more ways to avoid the liberal revolution event.
    look into the global revolution event-data. If i remember correct, for prussia it is enough to change the press rights. There are many posibilities to avoid this, without becoming a constitutionel monarchie.
    I hope i am correct but this way i had no revolution.
    The post stealing sausage-eater

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    not a beta for HoI3 Moderator Derek Pullem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.J.E.
    I believe you can avoid the 1848 rebellions with universal suffrage yes, but then, as prussia, you will experience the Bismarck counterrevolution which is much worse. Am I correct?
    The counter revolution is not certain (3% ish every month for 4 years I think) but likely.

    The liberal triggers have changed so that you either have to have wealth voting rights or allow socilaist trade unions - both unlikely with a monarchy
    "I NOW INFORM YOU THAT YOU ARE TOO FAR FROM REALITY."

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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Pullem
    The counter revolution is not certain (3% ish every month for 4 years I think) but likely.

    The liberal triggers have changed so that you either have to have wealth voting rights or allow socilaist trade unions - both unlikely with a monarchy
    I see. So we have a chance of having a counter revolution if we do universal suffrage, but this won't happen if we ride it out? Or will the 3% be always there between 1848-1852. There's one thing I still don't understand and that is why is it better to ride it out with no liberal reforms between 1848 and 1852 if there's only a 3% chance of counter rev.? Are revolution durations different in 1.03?

    Arado

  6. #6
    Paul Bäumer's gravedigger Becephalus's Avatar
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    Are you surethe 4 years are not earlier? I got some pretty severe revoltions with SP from 1846-1850
    Its always darkest right before it is completely black -Chairman Mao

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    not a beta for HoI3 Moderator Derek Pullem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arado
    I see. So we have a chance of having a counter revolution if we do universal suffrage, but this won't happen if we ride it out? Or will the 3% be always there between 1848-1852. There's one thing I still don't understand and that is why is it better to ride it out with no liberal reforms between 1848 and 1852 if there's only a 3% chance of counter rev.? Are revolution durations different in 1.03?

    Arado
    The counter revolution is an event which raises conc/mil by approx +3 across the POPS.

    So if you go democratic early then it is probable you'll get the counter-revolution (3% every 40/48 days = vitually certainty after 4 years). So youve avoided the liberal revolution in exchange for the counter revolution

    Liberal revolution ends with a conc/mil reduction of -3/-4 approx.

    Counter revolution effects are permanent.

    Thats why I prefer to tough out the liberal revolution.
    "I NOW INFORM YOU THAT YOU ARE TOO FAR FROM REALITY."

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    Second Lieutenant WiWi Walker's Avatar

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    Derek, I only introduced free press to prussia and i never saw a liberal revolution and i am still a monarchie. The date now is 1853.
    The post stealing sausage-eater

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by WiWi Walker
    Derek, I only introduced free press to prussia and i never saw a liberal revolution and i am still a monarchie. The date now is 1853.
    Let me follow up: will WiWi's strategy still trigger counter revolution?

    Arado

  10. #10
    not a beta for HoI3 Moderator Derek Pullem's Avatar
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    No - but I think he was lucky - the liberal trigger doesn't mention free press now. I had no reforms in last nights game and got the liberal revolution
    "I NOW INFORM YOU THAT YOU ARE TOO FAR FROM REALITY."

    Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf, (ex-) Iraqi Minister for Information

  11. #11
    Second Lieutenant WiWi Walker's Avatar

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    Ok, then i misunderstood the Event file.
    (i am clueless and cant read a textfile... )
    I thought that one opportunity was the combination of the right to ban parties and Free Press.
    So I introduced free press and thought that i was right because the Event never triggered.
    So i feel very sorry if i had spread false information around the forum.


    # Global Revolutions

    #META#1- The Liberal Revolution (Trigger: 1845+,lack of specified Political Reforms, ?Monarchy?)
    # A) The Revolts are spreading [POPs 4-6=Con+5,Mil+7/POP 9= Mil+5]

    # The Liberal Revolution
    event = {
    id = 25000
    random = no
    invention = yes

    trigger = {
    civilized = yes
    NOT = { government = { type = liberal } }
    NOT = { government = { type = anarcho_liberal } }
    NOT = { constitution = { type = democracy } }
    NOT = { reform = { type = trade_unions level = socialist } }
    NOT = { reform = { type = trade_unions level = all } }
    NOT = { reform = { type = voting_rights level = wealth } }
    NOT = { reform = { type = voting_rights level = suffrage } }
    NOT = {
    OR = {
    AND = {
    reform = { type = press_rights level = free_press }
    reform = { type = political_parties level = right_to_ban }
    }
    AND = {
    reform = { type = press_rights level = free_press }
    reform = { type = political_parties level = all_allowed }
    }
    AND = {
    reform = { type = press_rights level = censorship }
    reform = { type = political_parties level = right_to_ban }
    }
    AND = {
    reform = { type = press_rights level = censorship }
    reform = { type = political_parties level = all_allowed }
    }
    }
    }
    NOT = { local_flag = { name = LIBERAL_REVOLUTION value = 1 } }

    }

    date = { day = 21 month = february year = 1845 }
    offset = 25
    deathdate = { day = 30 month = december year = 1920 }

    name = "EVT_25000_NAME"
    desc = "EVT_25000_DESC"


    action_a = {
    name = "ACTIONNAME25000A" # The Revolts are spreading
    command = { type = pop_consciousness which = capitalists value = 5 }
    command = { type = pop_consciousness which = clerks value = 5 }
    command = { type = pop_consciousness which = craftsmen value = 5 }
    command = { type = pop_militancy which = capitalists value = 3 }
    command = { type = pop_militancy which = clerks value = 3 }
    command = { type = pop_militancy which = craftsmen value = 3 }
    command = { type = pop_militancy which = labourers value = 3 }
    command = { type = local_setflag which = LIBERAL_REVOLUTION value = 2 }
    command = { type = plurality value = 20 }

    }
    }
    The post stealing sausage-eater

  12. #12
    Smurf Admin Administrator BiB's Avatar
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    AND = {
    reform = { type = press_rights level = censorship }
    reform = { type = political_parties level = right_to_ban }

    This one worked nicely for me last night.

  13. #13
    not a beta for HoI3 Moderator Derek Pullem's Avatar
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    No - don't apologise. I should apologise.

    I believe you are correct in that you can avoid the liberal revolution simply by instigating a free press (or indeed censorship) and permitting political parties.

    What I can't remember is if you can have political parties without elections?
    "I NOW INFORM YOU THAT YOU ARE TOO FAR FROM REALITY."

    Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf, (ex-) Iraqi Minister for Information

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    Smurf Admin Administrator BiB's Avatar
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    Depends what u mean, in my current game as Germany (monarchy evidently) I have loads of political parties (right to ban, multi party) but noone has voting rights so I basically just get to pick

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Pullem
    No - don't apologise. I should apologise.

    I believe you are correct in that you can avoid the liberal revolution simply by instigating a free press (or indeed censorship) and permitting political parties.

    What I can't remember is if you can have political parties without elections?
    Thats good to know!!! I tried to read the text file, but I coulnt understand what it was saying. If we have a free press and permit all political parties, we will not have the liberal revolution unless........???? or can you always get away with it this way? Also, can you have a counter revolution without a liberal revolution, or you need one for the other?

    Thanks for the answers
    Arado

  16. #16
    Second Lieutenant WiWi Walker's Avatar

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    I will try to help you.

    These are possible combinations of Reforms to avoid the liberal revolution:

    No.1
    press_rights level = free_press
    political_parties level = right_to_ban

    No.2
    press_rights level = free_press
    political_parties level = all_allowed

    No.3
    press_rights level = censorship
    political_parties level = right_to_ban

    No.4
    press_rights level = censorship
    political_parties level = all_allowed

    The lib. revolution will also NOT trigger when you have one of the following ruling parties or constitutions:

    government = liberal
    government = anarcho_liberal
    constitution = democracy

    It will also not trigger when you have one of these reforms:
    trade_unions level = socialist
    trade_unions level = all
    voting_rights level = wealth
    voting_rights level = suffrage


    The counter revolution can hit you if you are no monarchie anymore.

    For example: When you become a democracy you avoid the liberal revolution, but there is a risk, that you will see the counter revolution.

    Hope this answers your question. Otherwise fell free to ask again.
    The post stealing sausage-eater

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    Reichsmarschall Paradox Dev Team Darkrenown's Avatar
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    Damn, I listened to Derek and sat through the liberal revolution instead of getting censorship/right to ban. Next time I trust the .txt files over the mod
    Relentless madman.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by WiWi Walker
    I will try to help you.

    These are possible combinations of Reforms to avoid the liberal revolution:

    No.1
    press_rights level = free_press
    political_parties level = right_to_ban

    No.2
    press_rights level = free_press
    political_parties level = all_allowed

    No.3
    press_rights level = censorship
    political_parties level = right_to_ban

    No.4
    press_rights level = censorship
    political_parties level = all_allowed

    The lib. revolution will also NOT trigger when you have one of the following ruling parties or constitutions:

    government = liberal
    government = anarcho_liberal
    constitution = democracy

    It will also not trigger when you have one of these reforms:
    trade_unions level = socialist
    trade_unions level = all
    voting_rights level = wealth
    voting_rights level = suffrage


    The counter revolution can hit you if you are no monarchie anymore.

    For example: When you become a democracy you avoid the liberal revolution, but there is a risk, that you will see the counter revolution.

    Hope this answers your question. Otherwise fell free to ask again.
    Thanks! That helps. I do have one problem remaining. My last game, I had u. suffrage but the liberal revolts still came into effect. Is there a random element to this?

    Arado

  19. #19
    Second Lieutenant WiWi Walker's Avatar

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    Sorry, when i tell you that i must kill you. Its a secret

    ....
    OK, back to Topic
    No, i am sorry, i have no explanation for that. It could be that i misunderstood some parts of the textfile. I am no expert in this (like Derek ). It just seems to me logical to work that way. Perhaps you are right and there is a random element... but i don t believe so.
    The post stealing sausage-eater

  20. #20
    not a beta for HoI3 Moderator Derek Pullem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arado
    Thanks! That helps. I do have one problem remaining. My last game, I had u. suffrage but the liberal revolts still came into effect. Is there a random element to this?

    Arado
    Universal sufferage does not make you a democracy in some cases - it makes you a Constitutional Monarchy. Prussia (and other traditional monarchies) is a case in point. This is a 1.03 change.

    Anti-royalist liberals?
    "I NOW INFORM YOU THAT YOU ARE TOO FAR FROM REALITY."

    Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf, (ex-) Iraqi Minister for Information

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